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During a mundane trip to Target, I stumbled upon an unexpected lesson in wisdom that turned a routine errand into a transformative experience. Join us as Debra Gaskill guides a spirited discussion on the essence of wisdom, anchored in Proverbs 9:10. We unravel the true significance of obeying divine guidance amidst life’s whirlwind, sharing anecdotes that reveal how choosing wisdom over raw emotion can redefine our identity and purpose.

As life’s noise crescendos, the ability to discern and heed God’s voice becomes paramount. Through my personal journey—marked by fasting and a momentous challenge—I learned to quiet inner turmoil and listen for divine wisdom. We share relatable stories, including a job that challenged my patience and how a shift in perspective turned frustration into a growth opportunity. Embrace the transformative power of obedience, patience, and a positive outlook amidst adversity, discovering how divine wisdom guides us through life’s chaotic intersections.

Explore the profound impact of self-governance and emotional control, underscored by personal tales of financial struggles and unexpected blessings. With Debra’s insightful commentary, we delve into the societal consequences of abandoning restraint and the pivotal role of setting a Christ-like example. Reflect on how obedience can unlock unforeseen rewards and stability in daily life, affirming that trust in God’s wisdom illuminates our path and fortifies our journey.

Where to dive in:

(0:00:00) – Wisdom in a Chaotic World (12 Minutes)

This chapter offers insights into finding wisdom in a chaotic world, inspired by a discussion on the Debra Gaskill podcast. We reflect on the significance of the reverent fear of the Lord as the beginning of wisdom, referencing Proverbs 9:10. Through personal anecdotes, such as a lesson learned in a Target store and childhood teachings from my mother, we explore the importance of obedience to God’s voice and how it cultivates wisdom. The conversation emphasizes the need for wisdom over emotion in today’s chaotic environment and encourages listeners to understand their identity and purpose through their relationship with God.

(0:11:42) – Wisdom Requires Listening and Obedience (12 Minutes)

This chapter focuses on the journey of discerning and obeying God’s voice amidst the noise of our emotions and daily challenges. We explore the importance of quieting our inner turmoil to hear divine guidance, using the analogy of a loud TV drowning out a distant voice. I share my personal experience of navigating a significant life challenge by fasting to subdue my flesh and seek wisdom. Through scriptural references, like Proverbs 1:20-21, we reflect on how wisdom calls out to us, even in the midst of life’s noisy intersections. I recount a personal story about a job that didn’t meet my expectations and how seeking wisdom and changing my attitude helped me manage frustration. Ultimately, this chapter underscores the power of obedience, patience, and maintaining a positive outlook in trying situations.

(0:23:33) – Obedience and Wisdom in Action (6 Minutes)

This chapter explores the significance of aligning with God’s wisdom, highlighting how obedience, even in seemingly irrational situations, can lead to unexpected blessings and growth. We discuss the importance of heeding divine guidance, using personal anecdotes to illustrate how God might ask us to perform actions that appear nonsensical, yet ultimately prepare us for future challenges and rewards. By emphasizing the fear of the Lord as the foundation of wisdom, I reflect on the importance of controlling one’s tongue and avoiding impulsive actions that can lead to regretful consequences. Drawing from personal experiences and Proverbs 29:11, we examine how unchecked emotions can harm relationships and careers, as seen in a cautionary tale of a man who faced severe repercussions after publicly venting his anger. This chapter serves as a reminder of the transformative power of wisdom and the value of patience and restraint in our daily lives.

(0:29:06) – Wisdom Requires Self-Governance and Growth (11 Minutes)

This chapter touches on the profound moments of self-reflection and emotional control, beginning with a personal story about the overwhelming emotions experienced during a routine task like taking out the trash. We explore the concept of self-governance, emphasizing the importance of self-control and the ability to manage one’s emotions to prevent destructive actions. Biblical principles are highlighted, such as the wisdom found in silence and the consequences of failing to receive instruction. We stress the significance of setting a Christ-like example in everyday life, especially in public settings, and discuss the concerning trend of people, including those in positions of power, abandoning restraint. This lack of self-governance is portrayed as detrimental to society, reinforcing the idea that the company we keep and the influences we allow into our lives shape our future.

(0:40:31) – When Wisdom Leads, Obedience Follows (13 Minutes)

This chapter explores a personal story of financial struggle and divine guidance, illustrating the power of obedience and faith. Faced with the challenge of finding a rental property within a tight budget in California, I recount a pivotal moment where, despite exhaustion from a fruitless search, I felt a spiritual nudge to visit a small, seemingly insignificant realty office. There, an overlooked piece of paper revealed the perfect home at the exact price needed, affirming the belief that God hides blessings for us, not from us. This experience underscores the importance of following divine instruction and the notion that God’s plans require our active participation and obedience. Through this journey, we are reminded that wisdom often involves surrendering personal control and trusting in a higher plan.

(0:53:09) – Wisdom and Practical Application (1 Minutes)

This chapter centers around the impact of God’s wisdom in our lives and how embracing it can bring stability, strength, and direction. I reflect on the hope that the discussion with Deborah Gaskill provided clarity and guidance to listeners, encouraging them to make practical use of God’s wisdom in their daily lives. We emphasize the importance of engaging with the word of God and prayer, highlighting that God’s word is the foundation for answers and creation in our lives. Listeners are invited to share this message, engage with future episodes, and find blessing through the teachings presented, trusting that God’s voice will lead them to His good plans.

About your host: Jaime Luce’s testimony has daunting personal mountains and treacherous financial valleys. She was trapped in day-to-day stress and couldn’t see a way forward. But how she started is not how she finished! And she wants you to know God has a plan for your life too, no matter how tough it seems. Today, Jaime has been married to the love of her life for almost three decades, owns two companies, and has become an author and podcaster. God’s way is always the blessed way!

Free chapter of Jaime’s new book: You Don’t Need Money, You Just Need God: https://jaimeluce.com/book/

Connect:

– Website: https://jaimeluce.com

– Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jaime.luces.page

– Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jaime_luce/

– LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jaime-luce-00395691/

Full Transcript

This transcript is auto-generated and not perfect. We hope it blesses you.

0:00:00 – Jaime Luce
Welcome to the Jamie Luce podcast. Well, today we have something a little different. I was recently on a podcast, the Debra Gaskill podcast. She went live on Facebook and we talked about the subject of wisdom in a chaotic world, how to use wisdom. What does that really mean? We really dove into the book of Proverbs and it went so fabulously I thought. I think that the Holy Spirit really did have an agenda for that podcast and the content, I believe, would not only benefit her audience, but I felt that it would benefit you all as well, and I asked her permission if I could use that broadcast as my podcast today and share that with you all. And she graciously said yes, absolutely. So today I’m going to take you into the conversation that we had together.

I pray that this is a blessing to you. I know that it will strengthen your heart If you’re dealing with things and you feel like you can’t hear from God. This podcast is for you. If you’re someone who is overwhelmed emotionally right now, whether that’s yourself, personally, internally, at work in the world. What’s going on in our world and the emotions of it are overwhelming. This podcast is for you. If you’re someone who is seeking to understand how to know the leading of the Holy Spirit. This podcast is for you. I promise you this will touch your heart and will strengthen you and give you probably some answers to some questions you might have. And so, without any more further ado, let’s go into that podcast.

0:01:54 – Debra Gaskill
Hey, hello everybody. Thanks so much for joining me again today, so thrilled to be with you and thrilled to have with me my friend Jamie Luz. She is a business owner, she’s a podcaster and she is the author of a book which we’re going to be talking about called you Don’t Need Money, you Just Need God, and I have read this book. It is amazing. Thanks so much for being here, jamie.

0:02:19 – Jaime Luce
Oh, it’s my pleasure.

0:02:20 – Debra Gaskill
Thank you so much for having me today, deborah uh, I, I, uh, I’m just so blessed to have you and and your wisdom and that, which is great, because today we are talking about having wisdom in a world filled with chaos. And boy, I don’t know about you, jamie, but you know, this is not my first day around the block and I have never quite seen a world like we are living in today.

0:02:47 – Jaime Luce
No, me either. It’s insanity.

0:02:51 – Debra Gaskill
So we are going to talk today about it seems like there is an epidemic of people who are choosing emotion instead of wisdom. They are heating up in a second. They are doing things that are costing them big time. You know, character takes a really long time to build a good reputation, but you can destroy it in a few seconds. And today, where there are video cameras everywhere, yeah, you know it catches you when you do things and then people just delight I don’t know why, but they delight in putting that stuff out there for the world to see.

Jamie, we’re going to start over in Proverbs 9, verse 10. And it says the reverent and worshipful fear of the Lord is the beginning, the chief and choice part of wisdom and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight and understanding. I’m reading out of the Amplified Classic, but I love that the worshipful fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. So if we are looking to be wise people, if we are looking to walk in wisdom, the first step, the beginning, uh, is to fear the lord, and I have an interesting story of how god taught me this. I remember I was. I was crying out for wisdom. This was decades ago and I was just crying out for wisdom one night. I was walking through a target and as I walked down this aisle I was the only person in the aisle and I saw laying in the middle of the floor. Was a case that you would put your CDs in? Remember back in the day when we used to like listen to CDs?

0:04:30 – Jaime Luce
Yeah, back in the days of dinosaurs, right.

0:04:34 – Debra Gaskill
Yeah, we’re talking decades ago and at least I didn’t say cassette tapes, but it was a CD case.

0:04:41 – Jaime Luce
Hey beat tracks for me.

0:04:43 – Debra Gaskill
Right there with you it was a CD case for me. I saw the CD case laying there and I felt the Holy Spirit tell me, put that back where it belongs. And immediately I wanted to kind of like say, well, I did not get off the show, you know, but I thought, okay, I knew it was a voice of Lord, I’m like okay. So I picked it up off the floor no questions asked, put it back and I just went on about my business, not having a clue in the world where this was leading Right.

So a few days later I was actually back in that same target and they had had a huge sale that day on women’s clothing. And I was walking through the department and there were stuff everywhere it was on the floor. It was just stuff was everywhere it didn’t belong. And I remember thinking, oh my gosh, lord, are you going to tell me to clean up this department? And he spoke so clearly, jamie, he said no, but if I asked you to, I expect you to obey. And that was how God started teaching me about the fear of the Lord that when I speak to you and you obey, that is the fear of the Lord and that is the beginning of wisdom which led me on a huge journey then and opened up wisdom to me, and I’m sure you probably have some stories that go right along with that. You were sharing with me about the way your mom raised you.

0:06:08 – Jaime Luce
Yes. So she just wanted to make sure that we always understood a few principles before leaving the house when we were old enough to venture out without parental guidance, right? So she would say things like remember who you are and whose you are, just to remind us that you belong to the Lord, you belong to us, you know who you are and whose you are, just to remind us that you belong to the Lord, you belong to us, you know who you are, but you belong to the Lord. But then she’d always add this scripture that says remember there’s nothing hidden that shall not be uncovered. And so she was letting us know, and we knew. We knew mom prayed. I mean, we knew her life before the Lord.

I would wake up, mostly on Saturday mornings because that’s when I could sleep in. It wasn’t a school day but we would be sleeping in and we would wake up to her literally storming and marching the floor in the rooms next to us, just tearing down whatever needed to get tore down and building up whatever needed to get built up, and hearing from the Lord get torn down and building up whatever needed to get built up, and hearing from the Lord. And it would be amazing how many times the Holy Spirit would speak something to her that she had no way of knowing. You know, it’s the. I thought about this when I was just praying in preparation for this today, that when you have the ability to hear from the Holy Spirit, no matter what is happening around you, you have the ability, just like in scripture when the King’s being confronted and says somebody is listening to what I’m saying and they’re like who is the traitor, who’s the mole in here giving away our secrets, saying where we’re going to be telling what we’re going to do, and they said, no, it’s the prophet.

The prophet knows and it’s by the spirit of god. We know he can speak something to us that in no other way would we have the ability to know that. But he can speak a right now, important, critical, strategic word that we need to have to make a good, right, healthy, blessed, all of the things kind of a decision, the things that the blessing of the Lord makes rich and adds no sorrow. When you need to know what you maybe couldn’t know, he can tell you. She has to be able to tune in and understand that he’s smarter than you are and it matters what he thinks more than what you think and no matter what you’re feeling, seeing doing. You need to know his input.

0:08:38 – Debra Gaskill
Amen, always, always, always. You know I love that scripture that says trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not to your own understanding. Even if the things you think you can figure out, we still need to acknowledge him in all our ways, which was so profound. I thought about this that sometimes God, when he’s really trying to get something over to us, a piece of wisdom to help us make a decision or turn a different way, take a different path, he will speak again and again when it’s really important. Samuel, samuel, saul, saul, barely, barely.

God does not repeat himself for kicks. Sometimes it takes more than once. So perhaps the Lord is trying to get wisdom over to somebody. So every time they turn on a different message on Christian TV or somebody will say, hey, I really think you need to watch this YouTube video and maybe it’s about losing weight, maybe it’s about eating healthier, maybe it’s about stop using your credit card.

But you say, every time I listen to a message, I’m hearing the same thing. That is God’s wisdom trying to get over to you and, like you said, we have to listen to that voice, whether it’s your mom’s voice or it’s that voice saying, hey, put that back on the shelf, even though you didn’t knock it off, or listening to this repeated messages that are always coming at us. We have to stop and say you know what, just like you said, jamie, the Holy spirit knows better than I do, right, and he’s in heaven and he lives in me and he’s getting these messages from heaven and he comes and he transmits them unto me and it’s up to me to hear it, yes, and to act on what we have heard.

0:10:30 – Jaime Luce
Yes, absolutely. You know, before we actually went live, we were talking about how the Holy spirit uh, for me anyway, this is how he works in me. I, I have to recognize that I’m, that I am not attributing to God my lack of hearing. I have to recognize, because it’s so easy to say I’m just not hearing him, he’s not speaking to me. God doesn’t talk to me that way. I know he talks to you that way, but he doesn’t talk to me that way. I just don’t hear him. I don’t know.

I ask, and we hear people say things like this and I had to learn that is not true. If his word says that he hears and answers prayer, then that means when I’m calling for an answer, when he says to him who lacks wisdom, let him ask of the Lord who will give liberally. So the minute I need to know he’s saying I am, I am poised, I am ready to give you the answer and the strategies that you need for whatever you need done in your life. It doesn’t matter if it’s spiritual or natural, financial, relational, it doesn’t matter. He has the answers. He wants us to live a life that is abundant. He wants us to live a life that overcomes. So you need to know right, he wants to give that to us.

So I had to learn, every time that I don’t hear, I don’t get to hang on the excuse that well, god’s not speaking to me. Yeah, I have to take the ownership and say, obviously I’m hearing other things too loud that I can’t hear him. Obviously I’m listening to. My emotions right now are really loud. I’m really angry, I’m really upset, I’m frustrated. I’m really angry, I’m really upset, I’m frustrated, I’m really disappointed. And if all I hear is that I’m not going to be able to hear the voice it’s like having the TV turned up loud and someone’s calling me from the other room I’m not going to hear them. I’m hearing this. That’s right in my face, that’s speaking right to me, that’s what in close proximity. And if I’m too close to my emotions, if I’m too close to my wounds, if I’m too close to my desires, my fleshly wants, then I have to be able to remove that hindrance so that I can hear.

And for me, I was sharing with you. I’m walking through something right now. That is really a big deal. It’s a big deal and it’s. And having to hear the Holy Spirit teach me how to get through it, to walk through it. If you’ve never been this way before, you need to know the way to go. You need, like the children of Israel needed in the wilderness they needed the angel to go before them to show them the way to walk. They needed the cloud by day and the pillar of fire by night to not only protect them but to guide them in the path they were supposed to go. And so I have to like for me.

I’m fasting right now. I’m on my own little fast. This isn’t a, you know, it’s not a Daniel’s fast, it’s not a. I’m fasting one day, I’m eating the next, fasting the next day, eating the next, one on one off, one on one off. I am keeping my flesh subdued so that my flesh doesn’t get to dictate to me what I hear.

Yes, that way I’m able to say father, what do you want from me? What do you want me to do? How is the? What is wisdom in my reaction? What is wisdom in my choosing? What is wisdom in my decision-making here? And he is so faithful, he’s so faithful, you will hear him If you will obey. Submit your flesh, just how. The word is full of all instructions and over and over again, old Testament, new Testament, it does not matter. He says if you will do what I tell you to do, just do what I tell you to do. If you’ll do what I tell you to do, if you’ll do what I tell you to do, you will get the results that I have for you. It’s that simple. It doesn’t make it easy but it is simple.

0:14:19 – Debra Gaskill
Right, and you know what, jamie, you know when you’re not doing what he tells you to do, yes, you do, you know. It’s no different than when you’re a little kid and your mom says don’t touch the stove. You know, and and you just, it gets the better of you and you’re reaching for it the whole time and you can hear your mom’s voice in your head saying don’t touch the stove, and then you get burned Right, and that’s kind of how it is when we don’t obey God. Proverbs 20, 21. Actually, I’m sorry, proverbs 1, 20 and 21 says wisdom cries loud in the street. She raises her voice in the market. She cries at the head of the noisy intersection, at the entrance of the city gate. She speaks. So when you were talking about, god is speaking but we just aren’t listening. This says wisdom is crying loud at every intersection.

I remember I needed an answer one time to something. I was in a job, I had kind of been hoodwinked and I got. I took a job. That was sort of a bait and switch. They told me it was going to be one thing and, yada, yada, you’ll never have to do this. And the minute I got in it wasn’t that thing and I had to do everything they said I wouldn’t have to do. And then they wanted me to do more and more and more, but not pay me for it. So I got this, like just I remember I was listening every single day to Jerry Savelle and he did a message called seizing opportunities, and I would. I listened to that message over and over, over and over, and I would say today is the day because Jerry would say if it’s not today, wake up with the expectation it’s going to happen today, because I was believing for a better job.

0:16:01 – Jaime Luce
Yeah.

0:16:01 – Debra Gaskill
And so every day I was doing that, that. But every day that went by on, the clock was ticking and I’m getting more and more frustrated. And so I found this scripture in the amplified, where it says she raises her voice in the street, she cries at the head of noisy intersection. So on the way to work every day I sometimes I just get really practical, and as I was driving to work, and every time I’d cross an intersection, I would say out loud wisdom, you’re speaking to me, you speak to me at this intersection, you speak to me at that intersection, believing God for the wisdom of God. And it was only a few days. And I remember one day I was so frustrated at my job I actually stepped outside for a minute and I looked up at the sky and the Holy Spirit said it’s just as easy to be nice and kind as it is to be upset and aggravated.

0:16:56 – Jaime Luce
Yeah.

0:16:57 – Debra Gaskill
And that’s what I had become. And immediately I thought that’s wisdom. And I changed my attitude and I thought, even though they hoodwinked me, even though it was a bait, I’m going to do this job to the best of my ability. I’m going to go over and above, I’m going to be nice, I’m going to be kind, I’m going to stop being upset, I’m going to stop being, you know, feeling like I got the rug pulled out from under me. I’m going to stop it, amen. And I completely went overboard in the other direction, because I knew that was the wisdom of God. Seven weeks later, I was in a new job in an industry that I had spent many years in prior. So I came in kind of like right at the top, and in the first year I was given bonus money that would have equaled the entire year’s pay at the job I came out of.

0:17:50 – Jaime Luce
Wow.

0:17:51 – Debra Gaskill
That was the wisdom of God. But I am like, how do I get? What do I do? And then I just took it literally OK, intersection, you’re crying wisdom, wisdom, and I had to take a hold of that. I mean, sometimes we have to do what we know to do when we don’t know what to do.

0:18:08 – Jaime Luce
Right.

0:18:08 – Debra Gaskill
We have to do what we know to do. Yes, it just in that quiet little moment looking up to the sky, god showed me the whole. It’s just as easy, matter of fact, I kind of felt like it was harder. Later I thought you know what? Being in an uproar is even more difficult.

0:18:24 – Jaime Luce
Yeah, yeah it is.

0:18:26 – Debra Gaskill
It takes a whole lot more energy it did you know like you’re going to need Botox here? I mean I know it’s exhausting. It is being upset, using not using wisdom, making unwise choices and having to go back and back paddle and apologize. That is exhausting.

0:18:47 – Jaime Luce
Yes.

0:18:48 – Debra Gaskill
And using wisdom, although it takes some governance.

0:18:53 – Jaime Luce
Yes.

0:18:53 – Debra Gaskill
It’s such a better way to live.

0:18:55 – Jaime Luce
Yes, amen, that’s so good. You know I I’ve, in preparation for today, um, I had been reading all through Proverbs, um, and just kind of soaking, just soaking it in, just you know it’s as Christians we can be so lazy, sometimes we’ll read things that we’ve already read and we’re not allowing them the opportunity to truly speak to us and let it be new revelation to us. And I came across and I think it’s because of the version that I’m reading, I’m reading the English Standard version right now. It changes all the time, but that’s the one I’m reading right now and usually the passages of scripture, the way that I have read them. I’ll give you an example.

Let’s look at Proverbs 4. And in verse seven it says the beginning of wisdom is this get wisdom and whatever you get, get insight. Now the other versions I’ve read would say get understanding. I mean even back in Proverbs 3, 13,. It says blessed is the one who finds wisdom and the one who gets understanding. So it was always in my head you know, you get wisdom, you get understanding. Or you get wisdom and you get knowledge. And the word knowledge, it makes it seem kind of like you just need more information. You know you’re just getting more information. So when I read this version and it uses the word insight and it used it over and over and over again the Lord spoke something to me and I realized oh, that’s so good, it’s a, it’s a perspective change.

When you gain insight into something like, for example, if you are um, let’s say, you’re going to a counselor, and you’re gaining new insight into your thought process and into your personality and into why you do what you do, right, that insight is different than just having knowledge, because if you have knowledge, you can still use the same perspective with knowledge and it do nothing for you. Yeah, that’s true. When you get a new insight, that means you’re seeing it from a place you haven’t seen it before, and so that then grows the knowledge, that grows what you know and you’re able to gain new wisdom on what to do. It’s not just book knowledge, it’s not just having more information, it’s it’s having the ability to see it from another perspective, and that shifts things. So if you, let let’s say, you approach a situation and you realize I now have this greater insight, if I choose to use that, it frees me from the snare of my old thought process, my emotions, my old experiences, my, you know, it’s like they say how the brain, because it is the neuroplasticity and you can reframe old bad memories and create new ones.

The old ruts, they are literally ruts in the brain dug in and the thought process, everything just kind of goes right into those ruts. It’s like being at the bowling alley and you hit the gutter every time and you can’t get it where you want it to go. And it’s because it has to be reframed, the thought that you’re thinking, in order to make it go to a new place. You have to reframe from a different perspective that same thought, otherwise it will go right into the same rut thought, otherwise it will go right into the same rut. So the it was like understanding reading through all of these, saying if you’ll take this and look at this from a different perspective, don’t just be lazy doing the same old thing you’ve always done.

Dig into what I’m saying, find out what this feels like from some other position. What am I missing? Yes, and that way we’re able to say oh, there’s a new answer, there’s something in front of me, there’s a possibility I didn’t know was there. God’s wisdom is not just because he talks so much about the folly, those who refuse to listen and the chaos and the trouble and destruction that that will bring. But but it’s also then the blessing that comes and the abilities that come and the opportunities, like you said, that show up, that that seem to make no sense to the natural mind. To make no sense to the natural mind, like what did having picking up a CD case and putting it on the thing have to do with, you know, knowing wisdom? Well, because he’s teaching you obedience. Do what I tell you to do.

That’s wisdom. That’s what will get you where you need to go, yeah. And so sometimes he’ll tell us crazy things. It makes no sense to us. We think, why? Why tell you that? Do over and above on a job, that you’re being treated badly, what will that do for you? Because he’s saying, okay, that act of obedience, that’s wisdom. So now I’m going to trust you over here, bless you in a way that’s far and above what you went through over here. Plus, you’re going to have the experience and the knowledge to look the next time and know what to avoid, what to see. I mean, he takes everything that the devil meant for evil and he brings about good.

0:24:47 – Debra Gaskill
Amen, our partnership with his wisdom. That’s good. You know, I had an evangelist we were in a conference together one time and he told me. He said, I think that if you were driving down the street and God told you to stop and change your tire but it wasn’t even flat you would still do it. And I said thank you, because I knew what he was saying. He was saying God’s warning you that you’re going to have a blowout. You obey him before the thing happens, the thing happens. And I took it as a compliment because we again, god is training us.

The beginning of wisdom is the fear of the Lord. Just like you said, even when you don’t understand it, you do it. And Proverbs 29, 11 has always been a scripture that I have tried to kind of govern myself on. It says a self-confident fool utters all his anger, but a wise man holds it back and stills it. You know what? Anybody can shoot off a mean text. Anybody can make a rant of a post on social media. And if you know, when I hear somebody say, well, I just say what’s on my mind, I’m like, well, get away from me then. Because that said this has a self confident fool, yes, all his anger, but a wise man.

0:26:08 – Jaime Luce
Yes.

0:26:08 – Debra Gaskill
Holds it back and many times we get ourselves into trouble. We cross lines, we crash boundaries, we break up relationships because we can’t control our tongue. You were talking about getting in those ruts in our mind, but once it’s got a good rut going here, the next thing is it’s going to start coming out of the mouth.

0:26:31 – Jaime Luce
Absolutely.

0:26:34 – Debra Gaskill
I always think back to I don’t know if you remember this years ago, but Chick-fil-A was very strong standing against certain social issues, and this man thought it was a good idea I’m not sure why through window and he just unloaded on this very young girl who was working there, telling her what a horrible place she worked for, and on and on and on, and he filmed himself and thought he was doing some great thing for humanity. And then he posted it on social media. Well, it immediately went viral and because he, he had this thought, this thought it was just, it was just regurgitating, it was digging a rut and then he just had to let. That’s a self-confident fool. He lost a job, he lost a $2 million pension, he went from being the CFO of an organization to being on food stamps. Because it came to his mind, he couldn’t stop it from coming out of his mouth.

0:27:45 – Jaime Luce
Wow.

0:27:46 – Debra Gaskill
You know, jamie, I remember one day it was at that job where I felt like I had been kind of, you know, bait and switched and I was so frustrated and so everything was bothering me. When you’re, when you’re got a good lather worked up, you know, you’ve got the ruts digging pretty deep in your mind and I had let somebody borrow my car and when they brought it back they didn’t tell me they’d run over a curb curb.

So when I opened the door it made this horrible creaking noise because it got like a jam, and then the job and there were several other things that were just on my last nerve.

And I remember leaving work one day and I was just fit to be tied and on the way home I stopped at the grocery store. This was before I had the wisdom of God, you know, when he told me. That day I stopped at the grocery store and I pull up and I parked way far out in the lot because I didn’t want anyone to hear my car door creaking, just as I did. This guy about half my age whips in right in front of me in a brand new BMW and just as I was closing my door he got out of his car and he heard the creak and he turned around and looked at me and went like loser, you know. And I remember walking up to the grocery store and I could just feel the tears welling up in my eyes.

You know, I was so sorry for myself.

Yeah sorry for myself. Yeah, I had to get home and you know, I held myself together in the store and I got home and I saw that nobody had taken out the trash and it was. It was piled up in the kitchen and I’m like, oh, I got it all going again. I’m working at this job and my car’s making this noise and you know, now nobody took out the trash. And now I’ve got to take out the trash and I walked it out to the garage. And when I’ve got to take out the trash and I walked it out to the garage, and when I got out to the garage the tears were starting to come.

And I’m just rehearsing in that rut in my mind and here it starts to come out of my mouth and I’m telling you it was like remember that scene in the Ten Commandments where the earth opens up and swallows? Yeah, it felt like that kind of a moment and I mean I’m not saying I heard the voice of god audibly, but it sounded like it sounds like it, yeah, and I heard these words govern yourself. And it wasn’t like god was denying my right to have an emotion, but he was denying me to just let it all out, all over the place.

0:30:23 – Jaime Luce
Right.

0:30:23 – Debra Gaskill
Because once you start thinking it and then you start speaking it, then you start acting on it. You’ve seen as well as I have all the people in the news that they don’t even have a criminal record but they do one thing in the heat of the moment they drive drunk and kill somebody. Now they’re in jail for 25 years. They think their spouse is cheating, so they follow them and then they they shoot some innocent person that it was just a friend, a colleague from work. That just happens all the time and unfortunately, unfortunate outbursts are also happening in the church world. And God is saying you know what it’s a self-confident fully. We have to learn. We have to develop the fruit of self-control and learn how to allow God to instruct us in his ways and seek his wisdom so that we don’t end up destroying our life or leading those people around us in a wrong path. And they say wow.

I didn’t know she acted like that. We have got to grow up and have self-governance and self-leadership.

0:31:37 – Jaime Luce
Yes, absolutely. Two scriptures are popping into my mind and I’m hoping I can find the second one here. It’s in Proverbs, but the first one is that even a fool we thought of as wise when he’s silent oh yes, I mean, that’s literally. It amazes that we can, even if you are somebody who doesn’t know and doesn’t have great wisdom and and doesn’t necessarily make great decisions. But when you know how to just keep your mouth shut, yep, that’s it. Just if you can just learn and it is it’s a fruit of the spirit to be able to use self control, that I don’t just allow my flesh to just do whatever it wants to do. The scripture I’m thinking of, if I can find it real quick, I’ll quote it to you versus telling you what it basically says, but it’s. It basically says that the person who doesn’t receive instruction, um, is um. He’s leading others astray, he’s harming others and and I, it’s a, it’s the.

We used to know this. We used to know this in the church. We used to know that people were watching us. We used to know, because the church was full of the fear of God, that we knew your life. Whether you ever say anything to anybody when you’re out in the grocery store, when you’re, you know, eating at the restaurant with friends or by yourself, that your actions and your words are being watched. Yes, and your example. We are supposed to be as much like Christ as we know how to be with the help of the Holy Spirit, and that’s evident. They should look at us, even if they can’t put their finger on it, and just say I don’t know, there’s just something different about you. I mean, you know, I’ve had this happen before, where someone will come up and say it was because you didn’t do such and such that I started paying attention. You know, I expected to see this and I didn’t see that. I mean, it’s appalling right now to me to see the foul language that is coming from Congress, our highest government, that is supposed to be honorable and and it holds significance and it’s and the people are throwing off all restraint, and the word talks about that.

If you have to be careful, the minute people throw off all restraint, we’re in trouble. We are in trouble as a group of people, we. This is bad for the nation. It’s not good that people don’t govern themselves. It leads to destruction and it feeds. It’s another one of those things that, if you’re not telling your flesh no, you’re actually feeding your flesh, your flesh. So then, if you gather yourself, you hear all those people saying all those things, and you gather yourself to a group of people like that, you’re going to be the sum of the five closest people or the loudest five voices that you’re listening to. You’re going to be that. That is your future. Look at that, and that will be your future. Is that what you want? Look at that, and that will be your future. Is that what you want? So you know, we have to be wise enough to say, okay, I am wise as a serpent, meaning I have discernment, I have, by the power of the Holy Spirit, the ability to understand. That’s not good.

That doesn’t look like God that you know and be able to, even if it’s, even if someone is a baby Christian. If something is truly good, it’s God. If it’s not, just stay away, if it doesn’t scream God to you and you don’t know which way to walk. You know, to me it’s just kind of a thing. Something can just not feel right. I may not be able to see it, smell it, taste it, feel it, but there’s just something inside of me, that little check of the Holy Spirit that lets you know something’s not off. You don’t have all the information. Something that you need to know is missing right now. So I need his wisdom and I need to steer clear it’s.

It’s like you said, the example of that man saying to you he knows that you would pull the car over and change your tire, even if it’s not flat, if there’s something I need to do. Yeah, and I love how God is so um, he’s so practical with us that even sometimes it will seem like it doesn’t make any sense, like changing a tire when it’s not flat doesn’t seem to make sense. And he knows he’s doesn’t have the time to explain to you and have a dialogue with you. Okay, if you come up here, 30 miles from now, such and such a car is going to come out. You’re not going to be able to see it, prepare for it. Even if you think you’re looking, it’s going to come out of nowhere. It’s going to hit you, and so I want to make sure and stop this before it actually happens. You know, instead of giving you 14 instructions and things to be looking for and to avoid, he says, pull the car over and change your tire.

Exactly so you do it, you take yourself out of harm’s way, because the timing is now changed and you’re safe, and to you the two didn’t look like it correlated, but they did. Yes, god’s wisdom makes sense, even though to you it may not make sense, you know what.

0:37:18 – Debra Gaskill
That is really important because I remember I worked with this lady. Important because I remember I worked with this lady and she had just got a new car. And then one day she came into work and she just sat down in my office and I could tell she was so downtrodden and she just started to tell me that the night before she had left work. And you know, we both live outside of Orlando, the driving is a little aggressive and on her way home her and another car collided. And because it was raining it’s funny in Florida when it rains everybody acts like it’s a blizzard up north. You know California too.

0:37:58 – Jaime Luce
California too. We don’t know what to do with rain. It’s crazy.

0:38:01 – Debra Gaskill
Yeah, I don’t know what to do. And so what had happened was because it was raining. It was raining pretty hard. It took the police like four hours to get there, so she didn’t get home till like nine o’clock that night. She has a wrecked car Now. The car has to go into the shop. It’s brand new. You know, her baby has to go into the shop and it was just a mess which she didn’t realize. When she told me that I was gleaning wisdom for that and I was thinking of all the times that somebody would cut in front of me and you know the kind of the aggressive driver thing gets on you and you know, probably not you, but it did me a little bit I’m honest before God, yeah, but you know what?

From that moment forward, anytime someone has tried to cut me off, I let them. From that moment forward, anytime somebody looks like they’re driving squirrelly, I back off. And the reason is because it’s easier to back off and get in second place than first place traffic light, than it is to sit on the side of the road for four hours or to have my car go in for repairs and to have my insurance go up because I was involved in a motor vehicle accident and so we have to. Always, wisdom is crying out at every street corner. It’s always talking to us and we would be remiss if we left today and did not talk about financial wisdom. I’m trying not to get a call on your book. You wrote this book I believe you published last year, I believe.

0:39:32 – Jaime Luce
So I think it was last year, okay, I read the book cover to cover.

0:39:35 – Debra Gaskill
It’s an amazing book. You don’t need money, you just need God, and it’s a playbook for getting your finances in order. Jamie, we have to stop every time. I know there are times in people’s lives where they need to reach out for financial help and you know, somebody dies at a young age and the wife is left, the husband passes away, and so we started to goundMe and everybody chips it. That’s amazing, but we can’t live our lives with GoFundMes. There comes a point where we have to take some action and we have to use wisdom regarding our finances.

And again, I want to say this if God is speaking to you about getting your finances in order, about not using that credit card all the time and he’s speaking again and again that is wisdom crying out to you.

And you tell a story in here. It’s decades ago when you were in a financial struggle and I’ve been there too at times in life, I know what that’s like and you had a certain amount of money that you. It was $1,500. And you said I can only pay $1,500 a month rent and you had exhausted what you thought were all possibilities, looking for a place to rent for $1,500. And you’re in California, so I’m assuming rent in California does not. I think it’s probably about three times. You know what it is here.

0:41:03 – Jaime Luce
Well, nowadays it it costs just as much. If it’s you don’t have the down payment, but the payment is the exact same as if you were buying and you have nothing to show for it because you’re renting. It’s ridiculous what the cost is out here right now, but yeah.

0:41:15 – Debra Gaskill
Yeah, that’s kind of how it is. Here too, renting is a matter of fact. Many people renting in my neighborhood are paying much more than I pay to own. It’s crazy. But you had exhausted what you thought was everything, but you felt that little nudge, that little inward witness of the spirit God’s wisdom telling you stop in to this realty company. You stopped in and it was the only one in town, so you figured he’s not going to know anything. I don’t know. I’ve been pounding the pavement, I’ve been looking for a place he’s not going to, but you followed the leading. When God told you to do it, you obeyed. It was the fear of the Lord and wisdom came out of that. I’m going to let you share what happened.

0:41:59 – Jaime Luce
Yeah, it was interesting because it was this little nothing office. If you, if you could see it now I mean, even I still the memory of it because it was so obscure like to go into this realtor office. But anyway, went into the office and there was a man standing there, real tall, older gentleman, white hair, and he kind of rattled off Well, did you? I know there’s this one and I had already seen the one he had he was talking about. We, we knew I know there’s this one and I had already seen the one he was talking about. We knew that’s not going to work and they want too much money, they’re not willing to come down on price, and so we just can’t do that. And he said, well, let me just look and see if I’ve got anything. And he went to dig through something and happened to, out of the corner of his eye, see a piece of paper that was had fallen between the thing where they had their fax machine and the wall. And he reached down and picked it up and looked at it and kind of went well, I mean, it was one of those. I think I may have something for you. That, and it was. It was the perfect house in the perfect location, exactly exactly $1,500. In the perfect location, exactly exactly $1,500.

And I knew I mean the moment that he said this property, my insides jumped, I leapt, my spirit leapt. I knew this was it. And what was so powerful for me about that was not. There was two things. One was I knew we tend to think that it’s almost like you know, we, we, we quote the scripture seek and you’ll find right. Knock on the door and be open to you. And people think that God is playing hide and seek and he’s hiding something from you and that you and he’s being mean and you’re trying to find it and you’re looking and looking and looking, you can’t find it. God’s hiding it from you. And I knew the Holy Spirit had taught me that day no, he wasn’t hiding it from you, he was hiding it for you, yes, yes. And and what that meant was this particular house was only going to be seen by this particular realtor’s office because they were the management company for that house. This house wasn’t going in all the other magazines and in all the other things.

And if I was the only one who saw it, literally, that I was the only one who saw that, that I don’t know when that fax came through, how long it had been sitting there, but I knew that God had held that for us. He had a place for us and it was for the exact time and day that we needed to have it. That God was so faithful that if I wouldn’t have stopped in there, if we wouldn’t have followed the leading of the Lord that day, I wouldn’t have had that. I don’t know where we would have been. I don’t know what have happened.

God had a plan, and so many times we say okay, god has a plan for my life, so he’s just going to make it all fall into place. I would, I, that would be nice, but that’s not the way it works. He expects us to take his instruction and follow it in order to get where we’re supposed to go. If that wasn’t true, then you wouldn’t have all the books of the prophets who said do this and you’ll get that. If you don’t do this, you’re not going to get that. You and you’ll get that. If you don’t do this, you’re not going to get that, you’re going to get this.

It’s obedience is everything. Obedience is. You know, I’ve said this, heard this, quoted this, heard it again. My pastor quoted it on partial obedience is disobedience, yes, yes. So we have to get to the place that we totally surrender. Wisdom says God knows better. I have to submit my will, my ideas, my plans. For people who are controllers and planners, this is hard. This is really hard because you think, okay, I know how to make this happen, I could do this, I could do that, we start building all these things, and none of that is bad, but it does not mean that that’s the path or the way that God’s going to make something happen for you. You know, my natural ways can only produce natural means, but his supernatural ways can produce supernatural things in my life, and that’s usually what I need is the supernatural.

0:46:03 – Debra Gaskill
We all know, we all. And you said something very important. This is one of, I think, the greatest fallacies being preached from pulpits today. God is in control or girl, you got this? The catchphrase girl you got this. No, he is not in control. He has put you in control. To be led by his wisdom.

And to say that God is in control is just putting off your own breakthrough your own victory to say girl, you’ve got this, not without the wisdom of God, you don’t, girl dude? As we close, jamie, I want to read something from your book. In regard to what you were talking about with finding that place that was being held for you, you said having the Holy Spirit gives us access to hidden information. You had access all along. There was hidden information all along, but you had to act on the leading of the Holy Spirit when wisdom was crying out at the street corner. Jamie, go in the real estate Right here.

0:47:16 – Jaime Luce
Come here.

0:47:17 – Debra Gaskill
You had to pull your car over. You couldn’t have driven by the office and said God’s in control. God is not going to beam you out of your car, yes, and drop you supernaturally into that house. You had to leave. You had to follow the leading, get out of the car, go in, talk to the man and then go sign the contract and then move into the house. Right, right, wisdom is not saying God’s in control, right?

right wisdom is obeying the leading of the holy spirit. Amen, amen, uh, would you like to pray for people who just need a nudge in the right direction, that self-governance governing themselves, and also that they would obey the voice of God? You can’t help them obey, but if they will receive your prayer and become a more obedient person, they can be helped. Amen.

0:48:13 – Jaime Luce
Yes, absolutely, heavenly Father. We just thank you that you have given us and we know this by your word. But you have given us access to all knowledge. You have said that all we have to do is ask and you will give that to us. It’s that simple. We just need to humble ourselves and say and recognize that we don’t have all the information, that we maybe don’t have the gift set, or that we maybe don’t have the gift set, or that we don’t necessarily have the knowledge about something, or we don’t have the relationship connections. Whatever it is that we are lacking, father, you know how to give to us what we need. You know how to take us where we need to go. You know where the open doors are, you know where the access is and we have to come to the place of surrender. That knowledge is great, but wisdom says that I would take the knowledge of God and I would make it useful by obedience, that it’s not just sitting there, that I actually use what you give me to do what you’ve called me to do.

God, I pray for every person who is under the pressure and the weight of their emotional state. The weight of the emotions is so heavy that it is hard to hear what you’re saying to them and it’s really hard to overcome their own flesh, and we know that to overcome the flesh, we need more of the spirit. So, father, I just pray right now that each person who is struggling in their emotions would submit those to you. They would admit their lack and submit those emotions to you right now. And, father, we ask that you would give them the wisdom of how to stop feeding those things, stop feeding themselves flesh, stop feeding themselves the things that interfere with their ability to hear you. God, we know that you have given us all that we need for life and godliness. There is nothing that you are holding back from us. That we need, it is simply our obedience. And for those who need a different perspective, they need to see things from insight.

Father, I pray that the voices that you have ordained for them to hear whether through something they see, they hear, they read Lord, that they would take that and understand that you are speaking to them a new way, a new way to see, a new way to expect, a new way to speak, a new way to think that they are not trapped in the old ruts and that they are able to make good decisions going forward, that they are able to move under self-control, that they don’t find themselves as the fool in scripture, who lives a life of folly and unable to attain what you have planned for them. We know, according to your word, you have a good plan for their life. We know, according to your word, that you have not evil planned for them, but good, that you are on their side Well, technically we’re on your side, but that you are with them. If they will acknowledge you in all their ways, you will direct their path. So, god, we give you permission.

Today, we we settle our own hearts and we say, father, we are listening, we are listening for your instruction, no matter how obscure, no matter how um, um, how much it seems like it doesn’t match what we are dealing with. We are going to take what you say and we’re going to obey and we’re going to watch and see how you move and open doors and change circumstance and correct thinking. Bring joy instead of anger, bring peace instead of anxiety. That, god, you will show your people how to live an overcoming life and we give you all the thanks and the praise for it. You deserve it all. In Jesus name, amen.

0:52:42 – Debra Gaskill
Amen. Thank you, jamie, and thank you for being with me as a joy, as always, to be with you. God bless you for sharing, and I will have the link to her book when we get out the broadcast. I’m able to put that in the description of the podcast. Thank you, jamie, you’re such a blessing.

0:52:58 – Jaime Luce
Oh, it’s my pleasure. Thanks so much for having me. Thank you everybody.

0:53:02 – Debra Gaskill
Bye, bye.

0:53:09 – Jaime Luce
Thank you so much for taking the time to join me with Deborah Gaskill, and my hope is that the Lord truly ministered to your heart, answered some questions for you, gave you some stability and strength and a path forward. I really hope that this will be something that you will make practical in your own life. The wisdom of God is so available if we will avail ourselves to it. So thank you so much again for taking the time to listen. If this blessed you, please share this. You can click the like button also ring the bell, get notified when new episodes come about.

We’d love to have the opportunity to just bless your life with the word of God. That’s the passion that this podcast is all about is giving you the depth and the breadth of the word of God, and we know that the word is what brings answers. The word of God is what creates in our life. The word of God is what directs in our life. Hearing his voice and following his words will lead us into the good plans that he has for us. So be blessed today, spend some time in the word and in prayer and watch how God answers your prayers.