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About The Episode:
- What the concept of self-governance is
- How to overcome challenges and take personal responsibility
- The line between faith and fantasy while setting goals
- How write down visions and share a positive message with others
(0:00:00) – Interview With Deborah Gaskell (4 Minutes)
This chapter features a conversation with author Deborah Gaskell about her book, Single and Sublime. We discuss her personal story and the valuable lessons she learned, including becoming strong in spirit and building resilience. Deborah shares her wisdom and humor as she leads us to a place of emotional health and well-being. We also explore how this book can help anyone, regardless of their relationship status, navigate through life’s difficulties and live an extraordinary life.
(0:03:59) – Life Transformations and Defying Taboos (11 Minutes)
This chapter explores the personal story of the host, who shares her experience growing up without maternal affection and how it affected her relationships. She discusses her desperation for attention and how it led her to marry the first person she seriously dated, despite numerous red flags. The host shares how her husband’s verbal and physical abuse became her reality, and how she felt trapped due to societal pressure against divorce. She also talks about turning to God during the worst moments and a pivotal experience that changed her perspective. The chapter ends with a reminder to not look for a project in a partner, but rather a partner.
(0:15:03) – Governing Yourself (5 Minutes)
This chapter explores the use of food, alcohol, or drugs as coping mechanisms for emotional pain. The hosts share personal experiences and discuss the negative consequences of these unhealthy habits. They emphasize the importance of self-control and taking every thought captive. The teachings of Dr. Caroline Leith are mentioned, highlighting the interconnectedness of our thoughts, feelings, and choices. Overall, this chapter emphasizes the power of self-control and the need to assess our emotions and thoughts.
(0:20:00) – Self-Governing and the Love Zone (4 Minutes)
This chapter explores the topic of self-governing and its positive impact on our physical and emotional well-being. We discuss the importance of assessing our thoughts, feelings, and actions in order to gain control over them. Additionally, we touch on the concept of the “love zone” and how our bodies are designed to function in this state. Self-control is emphasized as a powerful tool to quickly snap out of negative emotions. We also delve into the differences between the male and female brain in terms of emotional processing. Overall, this chapter highlights the significance of self-governing and its influence on our overall health and well-being.
(0:23:56) – Overcoming Challenges and Taking Personal Responsibility (7 Minutes)
This chapter explores the topic of self-pity and its impact on our lives. We discuss how self-pity can feel like a heavy jacket that weighs us down and becomes a trap if we let it control us. Through personal stories and examples, we show how self-pity can be overcome by stepping into the supernatural and asking the right questions. We emphasize the importance of not staying in a state of self-pity and taking action to improve our situations. Additionally, we delve into the concept of leading ourselves and highlight our power to change and grow. Overall, this chapter encourages listeners to take control of their thoughts and emotions, avoiding the trap of self-pity.
(0:30:46) – Discovering the Power to Overcome Challenges (16 Minutes)
This chapter explores the theme of redemption and how it can be found in challenging situations. The hosts share a personal story of praying for someone for five years and realizing their own role as an obstacle in that person’s return to God. They emphasize the importance of reading books that have already done the research and work for us, rather than trying to do it all ourselves. The conversation then shifts to the significance of being prepared for tough situations, such as financial struggles or abusive relationships. Valuable lessons and advice are shared from the hosts’ own experiences, highlighting the need to be both kind and wise in difficult circumstances. This chapter serves as a roadmap for navigating through tough times, providing guidance and wisdom.
(0:46:27) – Examining Fear, Red Flags, and Self-Improvement (10 Minutes)
This chapter explores the topic of relationships and provides valuable insights on how to navigate them in a healthy way. We discuss the importance of introspection and examining red flags, as well as the need for effective communication and seeking counseling if necessary. The conversation also touches on the idea of personal growth to attract better relationships and emphasizes the importance of being a good leader. Overall, this chapter offers guidance on how to have successful and fulfilling relationships.
(0:56:53) – Faith vs. Fantasy in Setting Goals (11 Minutes)
This chapter explores the topic of faith versus fantasy and how we can navigate our lives without being hindered by past experiences. The host, Deborah, shares her personal journey of setting high goals and trusting in God’s promises, while also cautioning against falling into the trap of fantasy. She emphasizes the importance of continually hearing the word of God to maintain faith. Deborah recounts a story of how she learned to let go of her fantasies and trust in God’s plan, which ultimately led her to find the perfect home for her family. She reminds listeners that emotions can often lead us astray and encourages self-reflection and self-governance. This chapter serves as a reminder to stay grounded in faith and avoid getting lost in fantasy.
(1:08:00) – Navigating Pain and Finding Purpose (5 Minutes)
This chapter explores the topic of finding our true passion and purpose in life. We discuss how our unmet needs and unresolved pains can drive us towards certain goals or desires, rather than the leading of the Holy Spirit. We also touch on the danger of pride and how it can hinder us from surrendering to God’s plan. We encourage listeners to take time for introspection and submit their desires and plans to God, allowing Him to guide them towards their true purpose. We emphasize the importance of discerning between the voice of God and the voice of our own pain or the enemy. The chapter ends with a reminder to follow both our passion and plan in order to come alive and fulfill our purpose.
(1:12:43) – Importance of Writing and Pursuing Vision (9 Minutes)
This chapter emphasizes the importance of writing down and pursuing the vision that God gives us. We discuss the need for a clear and specific vision, and the benefits of writing it down to stay focused and motivated. Our personal experiences highlight how having a vision has helped us in various areas of our lives. We encourage listeners to consistently keep their vision before them and take action towards it, even in the face of challenges or discouragement. We also stress the significance of having a plan and being intentional in pursuing our visions.
(1:21:30) – Finding Vision and Overcoming Numbness (13 Minutes)
This chapter explores the topic of numbness and its impact on our lives, including a loss of sensation and vision that can lead to a lack of self-recognition. The hosts emphasize the dangers of allowing numbness to govern our lives and stress the importance of acknowledging and processing our feelings. They share an inspiring story about four lepers who took action and were rewarded with abundance. The hosts encourage listeners to avoid staying in a state of numbness and instead have a vision for their future. They remind us not to let circumstances disfigure our lives and to take steps towards growth and change.
(1:34:34) – Share and Spread the Message (1 Minutes)
This chapter emphasizes the importance of sharing positive messages with those who need to hear them. We encourage our listeners to spread our message by liking and sharing, and to reach out to us through email or our website. Our book is also mentioned, which is available on our website and Amazon. Thank you for joining us, and we look forward to connecting with you again in the future.
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Full Transcript
This transcript is auto-generated and not perfect. We hope it blesses you.
00:00 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Well, not the truth. If you know Jesus Christ, there’s no way we should be thinking that we are stuck as victims, period. No way. He is victorious over all. So we have that same spirit living inside of us that’s still available to us. We just have to teach ourselves to access it.
00:25
Welcome to the Jamie Luce podcast. Thank you so much for joining me today. I have a special guest with me, deborah Gaskell, and she is an author. I want to give you her bio, but I’m just excited to have her. She’s a. I consider her a friend. I know that we are long distance and we’ve not got to be in person yet, but I love her spirit, I love her heart. You’re going to love her book, which we’re going to be talking about today Single and Sublime. This book has a fantastic way of helping somebody go from whatever struggle that they are in in desperate situations, and learning how to claw your way out and get yourself into a place of victory and a new path forward that God has designed for you. So we’ve got a great, a great program for you today.
01:16
Deborah Gaskell is an author, an inspirational speaker, missionary, and has helped countless others discover their God-given specificity. I can say that In Single and Sublime, she shares her own story and the valuable lessons learned along the way, which include becoming strong in spirit, which I love, no matter what life is, dishing out amen and building resilience. With wisdom and humor, she leads the reader to a place of emotional help and well-being so they can recover from bad relationship choices and live an extraordinary life. I want to say, right off the back, if you it doesn’t matter who’s listening today, male or female, I don’t care if you are married or single we are going to talk about and in this book covers things just pertaining to life, just life. It doesn’t matter. Now, if you are single, especially a female who has gone through very traumatic circumstances, you need this book. You need this book. But whether you have, that’s your story or not, if you have come through difficulty, if you are trying to navigate in life, I promise you there are tons of life principles that she gives at the end of this book, the last several chapters that literally are. They are spirit-born and spirit-led and they will help anybody who’s willing to put them into practice. So you want to get ahold of this book. I’ve got all my little, my notes here. We’re going to have a good one for you today, deborah, welcome.
02:44
Thank you for being here today. Thank you for inviting me, jamie, thank you, and I love the background. I love all the colors. That’s your personality right there. Her personality probably comes out in the book. I had the privilege of being a part of an author showcase recently and there we had, you know, there were a lot of books, lots of people and met them and all the different writing styles of people and in just even in the last several months, reading several different books and I just wanted to compliment you on your writing and your style and the humor in the book, because when you’re you know, it’s the old adage that a little sugar helps the medicine go down, because when we’re talking about difficulties, it helps to have you laughing along the way. Otherwise you could easily go oh, what is it?
03:35 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Oh, our kids.
03:38 – Jaime Luce (Host)
We get into that mess, but I want you to share with us a little bit about you, whatever you feel you’d like us to know, and how this led into writing your book. What was the makeup and what was the story behind giving us this treasure?
03:58 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Well, I’ll tell you, I grew up in a home where I had one other sibling, a younger brother, and he was highly favored by my mom, and so much so that he kind of sucked all the oxygen out of the air. And so I grew up without any maternal affection. I mean, my mom was there, but I can’t ever remember her giving me a hug or telling her she loved me. So it kind of set me up that when I got in my teen years, the first guy who came along and said, hey, I’ve got two donuts, would you like one? And I’m like, oh sure, you know, and I’ll go out with you too and I’ll even marry you. It kind of created this desperation for affection, for some kind of attention. And so basically, that’s exactly what happened. And, jamie, I wish I could tell you that you know, I met the man of my dreams and I’ve been happily married for 30, 40, 50 years, like my grandparents were. But that’s not my story and I’m guessing that probably somebody listening today that’s not your story either, and but it’s, it’s okay. And so what happened was I got into a relationship and married the first person that I seriously dated.
05:10
I knew there were issues that’s all kind of outlined in the book. I kind of speed through it because I didn’t want this to be a long piece of negativity. I wanted to bring redemption. Every step of the way, even when things were difficult, I was always trying to bring some redemption, some hope and, yeah, a little bit of humor. And so what happened was I thought well, you know, that’s all that’s out there. And I mean, what if there’s never anybody else, and this is the only fish in the sea? And then I go through life and I’m not only does my mom not love me, but then I’m single and you know all the stuff that plays on in a young woman’s head.
05:49
And so I did the unthinkable and I married this guy, even though there were a ton of red flags I mean, there were more red flags than you would see on a football field.
06:00
You know I mean at the Super Bowl, I mean there were just red flags everywhere. But I didn’t want to see it and I kept thinking, Jamie, I can change him. I could change him. But women and men, you shouldn’t be looking for a project, you should be looking for a partner. That’s good. You know, we are not sent to fix each other, unless you’re like a licensed therapist or something. And so I just kept thinking I could change him.
06:30
Marriage when we get married, it’ll all be okay. But here’s the thing you see the best side of a person before the I do’s, because that is when they’re out to impress. That is when you know they’re putting their best foot forward. And so I always tell men if you go to her apartment as her little one bedroom studio apartment and it is filthy do not think when you buy her Barbie’s dream house that she’s actually going to clean it. You’ll be cleaning it after you get home from work at night. And the same thing for women. If you’re dating some guy and he doesn’t work, he sits home and plays video games all day and you’ve got, you know, you’re the one supporting, you’re the one paying for the dates putting the gas in the car. Honey, I hope you like working, because you will end up working three jobs to support the two of you. So just you know, and you see that best side of a person. But I’m going to play blame mine on young, dumb and desperate. And so you know, as time went on, we got married and the problem was I really thought that if I could call him honey or dear or, you know, bat my eyes at him, he would just be the become this loving husband.
07:43
And by day two of the honeymoon he was verbally abusing me. I mean sharp, stinging verbal abuse that had not been there before. So even though there had been some red flags, there weren’t these kinds of red flags. I mean, my bridal bouquet wasn’t even wilted and he’s threatening me with divorce and verbally abusing me. And you might say well, what did you do to deserve that? I asked him where he would like to go for dinner. Yeah, and he told me somewhere that I believe that’s what the conversation was about. And he said I want to go thus and so and he goes, and if you don’t like it, you can get a divorce. And he wasn’t kidding.
08:21
I waited for the apology. I waited for him to laugh and say he was joking, which still would have been pretty bad. Yeah, because verbal abuse many times that’s the way it comes across the abuser will say something and act like oh, I’m just kidding, you’re too sensitive. No, they wanted to say it, but they sugarcoated it with laughter and acted like it was a joke. And you’re the problem because you couldn’t take the joke.
08:45
And so, basically, that that became my life. I mean, we were only married about four months and he had earned the nickname razor tongue. It was just verbal abuse all the time, it was name calling, and then one night he escalated to physical abuse, and so this, this, became my life. And you say well, why did you stay with him? Because in my family, jamie, divorce was taboo. It was not accepted in the denomination that I was raised in, and so I just figured this is my lot in life, I have to accept it. So what happens? You start having children, you start buying real estate, but having children and buying real estate does not mean that person is going to change. They are who they are.
09:30
We tried counseling, and then he started becoming involved with other women, and so, basically, during this time though what happened was the worst it would get I kept turning to God. And then I had a pivotal experience one night. It was so bad. I was pregnant with my third child and he had been in the middle of an almost three year relationship with a woman at work. And one night, I remember, I threw myself on the bed and I said in my own head, I said why can’t I be married to someone like and I mentioned the name of this preacher that I had been watching on Christian television that I just he really ministered to me and I didn’t want to be married to him. I just said why can’t I be married to him? Why can’t I be married to someone like a good, godly strong man, like even now that sounds so good. But you know, at the time I was like, why can’t I be married to someone like this? My life would be so different, which is truth my life would have been very. I wouldn’t have been throwing myself across the bed, acting like that.
10:41
And I remember it was like at that moment I stopped myself and I said God, no matter what, I am going to draw a line right now in the invisible sand and I’m going to cross over it and I’m going forward with you. I am not going to try and drag him where he doesn’t want to go. I am not going to try and get him to go to church. He’s on his own, he’s an adult. But I am going to become much more committed to you than I’ve ever been. I’m going to go forward with you. I am giving my life to you and from that moment forward, I can actually tell you that God is not going to be a good man. God started leading me and guiding me by the Holy Spirit. I became baptized in the Holy Spirit not long after that and I ended up growing exponentially. With an abusive, adulterous husband, I began growing exponentially in the Lord.
11:39 – Jaime Luce (Host)
You know, I love that because we can take, no matter what our circumstance is. We are the only barrier between what our relationship with the Lord could be. Yes, it’s just us, no matter who is around us, no matter what our circumstance is. He’s with me everywhere. He never leaves me. I can access him every moment of every day. I have everything afforded to me in his love and in his protection, always. Now, it doesn’t mean that we don’t go through things I talked about this in an interview I did yesterday where we walk through the valley of the shaft. However, we walk through it and the Lord goes with me. You are with me. I don’t have to fear that thing I may have to walk through. It doesn’t mean that life becomes a bed of roses, you know. It doesn’t mean that everything is peaches and cream. It does mean that I can grow. I am not stuck in this. Whatever mentality I have of myself, of my life, I don’t have to remain there. I can still move forward. I love that. That’s what was your heart I mean that’s what you’ve outlined in your book was really that decision to move from that place, and it was transformative. I mean hugely transformative.
13:09
You said something on page 82. And this, I really think, plays along with both the lesson learned in all of this. You have just talked about the proverbs 31 woman, how she’s a prepared woman. And then you come to this statement and it’s in bold, big capital letters You’ll learn yourself, yes, you’ll learn yourself. And you say this line and I love this because I harp on this a lot Self pity is like a stationary bicycle it takes a lot of output but it won’t get you very far.
13:43
That is true. You know that to me, is the. It’s a, it’s a pivotal place we all have to come to. Yes, we have to decide whether I’m Deborah and I’m in this mess, in this marriage, and this is a mess and I don’t deserve this. And yet I chose this. So I have, I feel the guilt of this responsibility and at the same time, I have children and I have the responsibility to help, guide and lead them. And what am I doing with my life? And is this? Am I going to allow myself to stay here? We could easily be like Joseph and be in that pit, but we can’t stay there mentally. You cannot stay in that self pity, pit.
14:27 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yes, exactly. Yeah, you know, jamie, I um a while back I watched a show called my 600 pound life and I watched a couple episodes of it and I felt so Just overwhelmingly compassion for the people who were being featured on the show, because almost every single one of them said I did this because I was hurt. I started comforting myself with food. It could be alcohol, it could be drugs, it could be. We want to take the pain away, yeah, but I have found that, whether it was the people on the 600 pound life or the people who, you know, get arrested because they go to a bar and they get arrested Because they go to a bar and they leave drunk and they get picked up by the police and get a DUI, and actually all these things lead to very life changing, negative situations. Right, but most of the time, thank God, these people will wake up one day and say I haven’t been out of my bed in seven years because I’m too. I’m doing something about this. This alcohol is ruining my life, this bad relationship is destroying the fabric and the essence of who I am, and that is where govern yourself comes in.
16:07
It’s kind of that defining moment that I wrote about that day I was having a massive pity party and there were just all these things that were building up, and building up, and building up. And it got to the point where I came home from work and one little thing set me off and that was that nobody had taken out the trash that day and I was the only one who had worked and the trash in the kitchen was like ready to overflow. And that took that pity party and just sent me over the edge and I could have resorted to something that would have been unhealthy or unwise. And I remember walking that trash bag into the garage and I’m just ready to throw something. I’m ready to break something I’m ready to. I’m ready to.
17:01
I mean I could feel that out of control thing and the tears were right there, but I mean they wanted to just roll and it wasn’t just about the trash, it was about all these things that built up. And I mean, if you’ve ever watched the Ten Commandments, when the earth opens up and swallows like Dathan and all that is what it felt like. I literally felt like my garage floor is going to open up and swallow me and I heard the voice of the Lord, not out here, in here and it was like a thunder, and it was not a kumbaya kind of message. I heard the voice of the Lord in my spirit say govern yourself. And I realized I had the ability at that moment to grab ahold of myself, to exercise self-control. Even when I was on the edge of going oh so wrong. I still, because of God in me, had the ability, because God would not have told me to do that he’s not unjust he would not have told me to govern myself if I didn’t have the capacity within me to do it.
18:13
And it wasn’t like I wasn’t allowed to be upset, it wasn’t that I wasn’t allowed to have an emotional moment, but in governing myself, grabbing ahold of myself, I could feel the tears go back. I could feel the anger come down when I really looked at all the things that had been building up, they really weren’t all that horrific. They could have been a lot worse. And once I grabbed ahold of myself, repented, got my head back on straight, started praying in the spirit within I think it was about 48 hours every one of the things on that list were completely fixed, and just think if I would have done something stupid.
18:54 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Right.
18:57 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Over yeah.
18:58 – Jaime Luce (Host)
You know, it makes me think of I don’t know if you are familiar with Dr Caroline Leith.
19:04 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Oh yes.
19:05 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Okay, this reminds me so much of her teachings, and she spends a lot of time explaining how our emotional state because our soul is our mind, will and emotions. She calls them what you think, feel and choose. Those are the and that’s the order that they actually happen in. You think first, you have a thought, you feel something about that thought and you make a choice. And that happens every three seconds. You are think, feeling, choosing, think, feeling, choosing. It’s, it’s constant all through the day. And that way, what you did is actually and I love, because this is what the Lord teaches us in scripture when he says take every thought captive, yeah, he’s saying to govern ourselves. He’s saying, okay, pull back. Yeah, take a look. Yeah, oh, we are out of control. I’m right here, you know.
19:59
And when we can assess, that very act of stepping back, what you did Actually causes your physical body To now work for you and not against you. It releases the blood vessels so you can think clearly in the brain. It releases the constriction of blood vessels around the heart. I mean literally just stepping back and looking at yourself as if you are watching yourself, just Act of self-governing. What am I doing, what am I thinking, what am I feeling? And she’s calls it this. She says that if you, it’s okay to freak out, yeah, okay to feel, we it’s better to, you’re supposed to feel. You’re not supposed to shove down and and squash.
20:43
But there’s a difference. When you feel what you feel and you step back and understand it, that scientists actually call it this. You’re in the love zone. Hmm, you were created. Every cell in your body was created to function in the love zone. That’s what they actually call it. Wow, it’s amazing.
21:02
Yes, it is two, two ways that it goes. It’s either love or fear. Oh, you’re not created to be in fear. So if you don’t do this, if you don’t govern yourself, you go into toxicity and your body will respond. Who will? Toxicness of what’s going on in your mind? So, letting our thoughts run wild and not captivating them, not taking them captive, not not saying to myself this isn’t really what’s going on. I’m angry. Yes, yes, these have happened. Yes, I need this to happen. This isn’t right. Yes, but my life is not out of control, it’s all right. I still have the power to make a choice. Is that? Yes, we choose. I can still make choices. It can change. It doesn’t have to stay this way. That’s the opposite of self pity, because self pity is like what you’re saying. It’s like you get on a stationary bike. You’re going nowhere, nowhere nuts. Your emotions go nuts. You feel like you’re spending every bit of your energy. Yeah, do nothing to accomplish nothing, to stay right where you are.
22:09 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yeah, you know what, jamie Perfect, I love what you just said, because when you govern yourself, when you exercise that self-control, what happens? You snap out of it like that. When you don’t, and you allow all that emotion and that it’s like a slime, you’re pulling off of yourself three days later at least. Yes, yeah, if you just keep letting it go. But the minute you govern yourself, which is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, and we have the seed in us. But these are, these are development opportunities that we go through and so that fruit grows when we are successful in so, in controlling ourselves, and immediately I snapped out of it. But I can guarantee you, if I would have kept on like that, I would have been a toxic mess for at least three more days.
22:58 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yes, in fact, as females, the male brain and the female brain are different in this respect. What they feel, they feel it’s explained in in a Triangular fashion that they feel sharply quickly and recover quickly. This so that’s why you know you can see guys totally fight it out and okay, let’s go get somebody Self the emotion. They dealt with it, they got over it and they go to the next thing. A female doesn’t have just the triangle, she has this extra loop at the top which means she has a greater capacity For more of the details about what’s going on, more of the emotion that’s going on more, and it takes her longer to get angry, it takes her longer to feel those things and because of that it takes her longer to recover. So in that recovery we will. If you’re female, it’s gonna take you longer. If you allow that, if you don’t keep it in check, you’re going to. Then, just like you said, this is gonna be days. I’m gonna carry this. It’s like wearing a slime jacket. You just just carry it and it has you feel like you have to wear off, like you have to wait for it to thin out and wear off, because it just is a weight that sits on you, and yet we couldn’t. We could affect that. We have the power God has given. The gift of God in us is the ability to do just that. Yes, say that, as a child of God, I can step into the supernatural, yes, natural, I can remove myself and look at this and then let the Lord begin to leave me in this, show me what. And we asked the right questions. You know we have to say okay, lord, what is this? What part do I play? What things can I change? What do you? What is the thing? You know he might tell us something that seems shocking and silly, and and what, what would that matter?
25:00
I always remember the story that my, my grandmother told this story once. I don’t know where she heard it from, so I can’t give credit to her credits do. However, there was a person who, a Woman who was really praying for a son who was going through something that was very difficult and his attitude and everything was just really bad along with it, and he, he was going to be stopping by for something and she just asked the Lord Lord, I don’t know what to do for him and while she was praying in the spirit, she felt the Holy Spirit say to her Go buy donuts. And she just thought, go buy doughnuts like how goofy is that. I don’t need a donut, I need help. Know how to help my son and what to do. Like give me the wisdom statement, tell me what scripture to get what you know right. Other thing that’s gonna help. And she heard it again Go get donuts. Hmm. So she said, okay, I don’t get it, but okay, fine, went and bought donuts, had him on the counter, didn’t even eat one, just put them on the counter.
25:59
And when her son came, he goes in the kitchen and he sees the donuts and begins to cry and Looks at her and there was something about the caring and that, for whatever reason in his mind, the donut represented something to him. Wow, in as a child and being able to confide in his mother. And he sat down and began to pour his heart out to her. She was able to pray with him. I mean it completely broke the thing that had been there, the problem that had been there, and Donuts go by, don’t you know? I mean so it’s.
26:32
It’s so important for us to not get it. Allow ourselves to just fall into that state and allow ourselves to stay there. We, we are only hurting ourselves. If you, I know so many times we want the rescue, we want, we want Jesus the Savior to come in and reach down and pull us out of the water and we’re saved. And we’re in the boat and we’re getting a beautiful blanket wrapped around us to dry us off. And you know, and many times he’s like get a bucket and get the water out of your boat.
27:05
Yes, there’s things we need to do you know, yes, we have control over.
27:11
He’s saying I’m not gonna come take out the trash for you, you can take this. This isn’t the end of the world. I know they should have done it, but it’s not the end of the world. Yes, there are people who don’t have arms. They would gladly go take the truck. I mean we have to snap ourselves out of our self pity in that way and realize there’s always somebody who has worse than I do and and some and it can be bad.
27:32
I remember seeing them mean once that I thought was it was a very it. Usually they’re funny. This was not funny but it was very poignant. But you saw somebody who was driving a sports car and the person who’s looking on it’s like Driving this kind of a beat-up old car and he’s admiring and and having self pity looking at the person who’s driving the fast sports car. Then the next scene is the person with the car, the clunker, going by. There’s a guy going by on his bike and he looks over and he thinks, man, if I just had a car, this is so hard that I have to ride my bike. And then you go next scene and the person is in a wheelchair and he said only I had legs to ride that bike. I mean, it’s just you know. We just Don’t understand. We allow ourselves to be wallowers. We just wallow in and Ourself pity when the Lord is saying you don’t have to be there, right, we’re wanting it better. It can be better.
28:41 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yes, better it can be. And you know what? I just saw something the other day, two words that just arrested me. It said lead Yourself. Funny, we’re talking about governing yourself, lead yourself.
28:56
And right after I saw this I had Reconnected on social media was somebody I knew when I was back in grade school, junior high school, and she was very as a child, she was very self-centered, she was very gossipy and I Noticed on social media that some you know common people, some of her things she would say and so forth, and I thought it’s been decades and you have not changed one bit. And I thought, jamie, what is it like? Because to anybody listening, and maybe you’re going through with something like what I explained earlier about the Infidelity and you’ve got the young kids and you feel like you’re trapped and yada, yada, yada. You can always begin to change you, yes, and that is empowering. You can read a book by John Maxwell on leadership and learn how to come up to another level. You can read Something or listen to this podcast about how to grab a hold of your emotions. And now you’re becoming more healthy in your emotions. As you begin to grow, you are creating a capacity in your life for God to grow your situation and grow your life. As you Improve, your life will begin to improve, and that’s where what you’re talking about Listening to the Holy Spirit. Whether it seems crazy or not, some of the craziest things that God has impressed me with have made some of the most phenomenal changes, because in my head I’m thinking how is this gonna matter at all? Matter of fact, what you were saying about the boy and his mom getting the donuts?
30:46
I had been praying for someone for five years. They used to be very sensitive to the Lord and through a series of just bad breaks, they completely you couldn’t even mention God around them and they would be like yeah, yeah, yeah, I know that. And for five years I just kept praying for them to come back to God. And then one morning in prayer, this person came up before me and God put his finger in my face. He said the problem is you. He said you don’t believe that, because of what they’ve been involved in the last five years, that I will show them mercy. So I repented and I started calling in God’s mercy over their life. God, show them mercy, send mercy.
31:29
I was the obstacle and within two days I got a text message from the person. Five years I’ve been praying. Two days later I got a text message. All it said is will you help me? Before I could write back and say what? What’s going on? I didn’t know, like, are you in a car accident? You know what happened. Before I could even write them back, they said I’m leaving work and coming to your house. Wow, showed up at my door and, through sobbing, repented and we prayed for this person to come back to God. Yeah, so we it’s crazy what I’m praying for that and I it was like somehow I, maybe I was the only person praying for them. I don’t know, but I had this mindset that, because of what they had got involved in, god would not extend the mercy. I know better than that, but obviously I did it anyway.
32:21
We’re not perfect, but see, that sounded crazy. Yeah but yet that was the key.
32:26 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yeah, you know, even in and you mentioned it you know you could easily just in improving yourself, yeah, well, and read these books. And I heard the best thing just this past week and it’s so true. I’ve never thought of it this way. But you know, we can’t all go and spend years researching and and on all the different subjects that that can impact us for good, but we can simply read a book that somebody else did all the research on, you know had all the experience with and you all you have to do is read it. You don’t have to go do all that work. You don’t have to go and spend years and hours and sleepless nights and and and Struggling with how does this affect that? And come to the answer it’s like these people have done all the work for you Exactly.
33:19 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Exactly what a lot of people don’t know is that this book was 17 and a half years in the making, wow, and the reason for that was because I wanted to capture redemption Even in bad, bad, bad situations, like people who are struggling financially. I had so many opportunities, so I call it in the book stash some cash.
33:40
Yes, where I had so many opportunities where, when I knew things were gonna go south, I knew things were going downhill. Yeah, I could have taken out an extra five dollars Every time I went to the grocery store and taken out five dollars or twenty dollars cash and started stashing cash. I could have started preparing. I could have, you know, done things that would have made my life easier or better. But I learned the hard way and that’s what I put in the book things like I heard a story one time about a lady who was being physically abused all the time she went to a woman’s shelter and they helped her plan her escape, and she had a young daughter and it was her daughter, not the man she was living with, and so there was not a custody issue there.
34:30
So they helped her plan, they they taught her how to stash some cash and how to have enough money to get out, and so she was ready to go and she was going to leave in two weeks and one night her abusive partner Was kind to her. Now that’s not unusual. In the book I refer to that as sweet and sour, that you’ve got all this sour and then it’ll be peppered with sweet to get you to stay. And so, in a sweet moment, she blew her whole plan. I was going to leave you in two weeks, yada, yada, yada, just told him everything.
35:14
The next day she got a phone call from him. She was supposed to go pick her daughter up from school. Like always, he went and got her early and Said don’t bother picking her up, because I’ve got her and if you ever plan on leaving me again, I will get her first and you will never see her again. And so that’s about the kind of things that I included in the book is because there will be some who who are listening, who are reading. I had a lady come up to me in church the other day. She goes. I am walking through this right now and it’s like a roadmap to me what to do, what not to do, and and it shows you how to be wise, what I did, because I was, you know, trying to do the Christian thing. I was very nice about everything and I should have been smart. It’s good to be nice, it’s good to be nice and I was very nice, but the other party was not.
36:13 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yeah.
36:13 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
And I should have been wise. Instead of nice Right, and so you’re absolutely right, why go through it?
36:23 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Let me tell you Right Because it’s like you learned these lessons, not because you got it right just happenstance, you know, picked the right things because you’ve learned from what you’ve experienced. This is these are things that are invaluable when you don’t know what to do, where to go, how to start. What you know, especially when you’re emotional you can’t. It’s hard. If you’re not governing, pulling back and assessing what you’re thinking and feeling, then you won’t have the ability, you’ll be clouded. You won’t have that. That’s literally physically cut off. You won’t be able to think about what to do. You’re just confused. It just seems like a mess and you don’t understand. Yes, it’s the thought that we have. I feel like what we’re doing is handing some people some power. Today, we’re saying, okay, we’re giving you your power back.
37:15 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yes, yes.
37:16 – Jaime Luce (Host)
You do have power. You are not powerless. And the enemy of our souls would love to tell us you have zero power, you have zero control over this situation. You are completely a victim. Yes, well, not the truth. If you know Jesus Christ, there’s no way we should be thinking that we are stuck as victims. No way. He is victorious over all. So we have that same spirit living inside of us that’s still available to us. We just have to teach ourselves to access it, to say there’s something I can do. I am not going to lay here and let someone keep kicking the dirt on me or I’m not going to allow this situation. It can be in a job situation. You could be in a horrible position at work and you just allow it because you’re not willing to put together the resume, you’re not willing to go out and make some phone calls, and you say I don’t have time, I’ve just got too much. And what am I going to do? And we’ll just talk ourselves out of the answers when we allow ourselves to stay in that position.
38:22 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
We talk ourselves out of a better life. We do. You know, john 10.10 says that Jesus came to give us life in abundance to the full, till it overflows. The amplified says and if you are looking at your life and I’m not saying everything’s perfect, but if it’s not an abundant life, if it’s not an overflowing life, if you are knee-deep in turmoil and trouble and emotional upheaval, you, my friend, are not living an abundant life. But you can. You can. It’s how, deborah? How, one step after the other. And if you are in a relationship, planning on getting married and I talk about this in the book.
39:11
Even as I was getting ready to walk down the aisle, my dad turned to me and said are you sure? No, I was not, but I didn’t tell him that because I was too proud. My dad is calm, cool, collected, very smart. I wanted to be like him and I could not admit at that moment. I was not sure. Because, then what do I go back to my mom, who doesn’t seem to love me. I’ve got this guy who, well, at least he’s willing to hang around.
39:41 – Jaime Luce (Host)
You get your need dictate your decision. Yes, instead of a decision that will affect your need. Yes, it’s a flip. We get it out of order, we get it backwards. And how many of us are guilty of that In some form or another, in decisions that affect us every single day? Every?
40:00 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
day we do that.
40:01 – Jaime Luce (Host)
We think that we let the need drive, instead of saying I am in the driver’s seat, my need is not in the driver’s seat, and God will show me how to rightly meet that need. He will provide for that need. We look for the quick fix. Yes, we always look for the quick fix. It’s never the answer.
40:22
Think of New Year’s Day. How many resolutions are made. Even if you’re good at it, even if you’re you’re good at it, most people don’t make it past 14. You just there’s something. The newness of it wears off, the desire or the motivation starts falling into a slump and we let things go. We have to be those that say I’m not looking to.
40:52
This isn’t a long jump, where I’m making one jump, one run and then I’m going to make all that ground once and that’s all I have to do. This is okay today. Lord, what do you have for me today? What can I do today? That way, I’m not overwhelmed. He’s actually being good to you. He’s actually putting, giving you tons of grace. Don’t worry about tomorrow. Tomorrow has enough stuff to deal with. Let’s just do today. Yes, if you understand. I mean I would love to live constantly with that knowledge. Just do this, don’t, don’t worry, just do this. Now. There’s things he’ll tell you to plan for.
41:26
I’m not saying we don’t live our lives looking forward. Sure, and as you talk about that, in the book too. However, we need to be those who understand. He’s not. He says his burden is easy, it’s the joke is light, is? It’s not. This isn’t a heavy, it’s not cumbersome. His commandment Stavis, says his commandments are not burdensome, that when he’s giving you instruction, he’s like to the woman you don’t have to come up with some, you know, high, finagled prayer and make sure you say exactly all the right words and just go buy a donut, buy a donut, you know, buy a donut, you know. And we make it harder than it has to be. Yes, and it’s. You wrote on page 120.
42:11
And again, nice big, highlighted, bolded, all caps word introspect, which totally goes along with this governing ourselves. Introspect, and I love this. When you introspect, you are examining your own mental and emotional processes. Just like you scan a computer for malware, you should be scanning the thoughts and feelings the person brings up. Get alone, get quiet, pray and journal. I love that. It’s practical, but it is exactly focused, pierced straight, right on the point. This is part of what we have to do.
42:51 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Go ahead and go ahead and talk about that for a minute, yeah, and when I talk about introspection, I am talking about when you feel a relationship may not be everything it’s cracked up to be. If you have questions, I actually. The steps I give are number one step back. Just step back for a minute. You’re dating someone, you’ve been out on five or six dates and all of a sudden you’re like I don’t, I’m just, I’m just so sure Something. Just when I see him pull up in front of the house, I kind of wish he wasn’t. Why am I feeling like, oh, I feel sorry for him. Maybe I’m just being mean, I shouldn’t be. No, when you feel like that, you have to listen to it. You have an inward guide, the Holy Spirit, and I suggest that you step back.
43:45
Secondly, regroup it’s a military term. It means some sort of attack or defeat that’s coming against you and you need a tactic. You need a to change your tactic Instead of just oh, no, it’s okay, I’m just going to keep trying. No, change your tactic, change your regroup. You need to think, you need to process. You can’t do that, telling 15 girlfriends about it. You need to get a loan, a loan time, and then introspect. Yes, you’re examining.
44:16
Why do they ask yourself questions? Sit alone in a room, get a cup of coffee or cup of tea and ask yourself why do I tighten up when he comes along? Why does she make me feel uncomfortable? Why do I feel like he’s pressuring me? Why do I feel like she wants all my money? You have to introspect. You have to look at these things and allow yourself to answer those questions and allow the Holy Spirit to lead you in those things. And we can’t just rush. I was talking about being ready to go down the aisle with my dad. Hey, until you say I do, you can turn around and say I don’t, but I have the dress on and the photographer and the organ’s beginning to swell. You can still say you know what? Have somebody make an announcement, there’s been a situation, there’s been a change of plan. You can all go on to the reception hall and enjoy a nice dinner and dance with the band. Brian had a wardrobe malfunction, whatever you want to say, but if you’re not sure about saying I do, you shouldn’t, you shouldn’t.
45:27 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Hi, my name is Jamie Luce. I wanted to share with you some information about a brand new book entitled you Don’t Need Money, you Just Need God. It’s a playbook for miraculous provision, and I want to share it with you because it solves the problem we are all facing right now. The economy is going crazy, gas prices are soaring, there’s wars and rumors of wars. We’ve got everything hitting us all at once, with interest rates rising. You need to know what to do, and so many times we think we need the money. But you don’t need money. I’m telling you, the answer is you need God, and that’s exactly what we want to teach you through this book. We’ll give you practical ways to know what to do and how to do it, so that you get answers now. You can find my book on Amazon. You can also go to jamieloosecom. You can also find this book at YouDon’tNeedMoney, youjustneedgodcom. This book is available today.
46:27 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Because here’s why, if you’re not sure, there’s fear and the Bible says in 1 John, chapter 4, that perfect love casts out all fear. So if you’re in a relationship, even a marriage, maybe you’re marriage. I’m not telling you to leave your spouse. I’m saying maybe you guys need help, maybe you need some Christian counseling, some marital counseling. But what I am saying is is that you have to work through these things and find out where’s this fear? Why am I jittery? Why am I uneasy?
46:58
You can’t ignore it, when red flags should never be ignored, they should be examined. We have this saying, jamie, that love is blind. Every language love is blind, but it shouldn’t be. Love should be examined under a microscope. And I’m not saying you pick that person apart. You pick out every little flaw. We’re all flawed, we all have things that aren’t perfect. What I am saying is that you need to introspect. It’s funny of all the things in the book, you picked that out Because that’s so important that you sit alone and you talk to yourself and you talk to God and you get the word out in front of you. If God’s showing you a scripture like don’t have confidence, or having confidence in a person, the wrong person, is like a foot out of joint or a broken tooth.
47:52
Red flag red flag red flag Danger Will Robinson.
47:55
And so we have to have time to introspect, because, if you just rush, my daughter was telling me about an acquaintance of hers that got into a relationship on October 4th it’s not even 30 days ago. She’s engaged and she just came out of a long-term relationship. What does that tell you? What does that tell you? I get scared at these people who meet online and then they see each other in person twice and get married. Scares me.
48:30
And I’m not saying God can’t do a quick work like he did with Dave and Joyce Meyer, but even they will admit they almost didn’t make it. And so you have to be certain, you have to listen to the Holy Spirit and you have to listen to your own heart and your own mind. And if your emotions are always, why does he do this to me? Why does she treat me like that? I don’t like it when they do that.
48:53
Well, why are they always looking at their phone and hiding their phone? Red flag, red flag, red flag, red flag. Why is it when I walk in the room, they always turn the computer screen away? Giant red flag. They don’t want you to see what’s on there, and you have to remember that when you’re dating a person, you’re seeing the best of them. And here’s the thing, my friends. Whatever it drives you into a bad relationship like I was, driven because of the lack of affection. Whatever the need is maybe you were molested as a child on somebody’s finally nice to you a little bit. If you break free from one and you don’t figure out what’s going on and get it fixed, you will attract the very same kind of person over and over and over again, because you will think that’s all you deserve.
49:46 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yeah, and that works in every kind of relationship. Sure, you have friendships that are that way and you just always feel like you’re getting the raw end of the deal. You know you’ve given and given and given and but that’s choices we’re making, not recognizing what’s really going on. I mean, to me this is the introspection that needs to take place, can happen Even if you, let’s say, you’re in a marriage and you’re you know that your spouse, for whatever reason, is not feeling close to you. It may not be that they’re doing anything wrong. It could be that I’m not doing right, I’m making them feel ways that that are uncomfortable and they don’t like it and they’re pulling back. You know it’s how many scriptures talk about the nagging woman and how often that is for a man to deal with, right, right.
50:34
We need to also be stepping back, I think, and looking at if we’re looking at the more the larger overarching, how this affects everybody. Picture what am I doing that I? How am I affecting my environment at work? What are my attitudes? What am I? You know, how do I deal with so and so? Do I have certain patterns? Ever the ends I do this? Why is it that every single time, this kind of thing. This happens every time. Well, look, take a step back. What are you doing? What are you thinking? How are you participating in that? What can you do about you? You know it’s that go back to. I can’t control everybody else. I can’t control all the circumstances around me, but I can control me.
51:22 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
You can’t control me and you know what? And it goes back to if you want more, become more, right If you want to. If you want better, become better, right If you want to be. You know I lead, learn how to lead, because some people I’m sorry, their leadership skills, they can’t lead anybody to the refrigerator. I mean, you know, we, we’ve all known somebody like that right and and if it wasn’t for the Lord, we’d probably be like that. But you hear the term natural born leader. Possibly there’s some traits there certain people carry. But I believe that leaders, more than anything else, are developed on purpose. It’s because I said, you know what. I’m going to make my life better. I’m going to learn how to be a better person myself. My kids were little. They always came to me mom fix it, mom fix it. My many escaped my this. My toy broke, whatever. Mom fix it, yeah. But then when your children get older, it was hard for me to pull out of mom fix it mode.
52:27 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yes, so every time.
52:31 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
I would come to me with a problem. I would think, oh well, they’re coming to me because they want my advice. Yay.
52:37
You know, mom fix it on the scene, ready to go? Yeah, and I had to pull back, and I had to I would listen. I was thankful that they come to me. I was really super thankful. They all still come to me with things at times. But I had to just listen and not start formulating something. And then I would say are you asking for my opinion? Yeah, okay, so here it is. Or if they said, no, I just needed to vent for a minute. Okay, okay, that’s good and I’m yeah. Even that is learning how to govern yourself. Even that is learning how to lead. And you’re so right, jamie. Your husband could come home and you’ve told him 30 times to put his socks in the hamper, but he throws them on the bedroom floor. Yeah, if you’ve yelled at him all 30 times and been a nag, maybe those socks aren’t going anywhere.
53:31
Find a way find positive reinforcement you know, walk him over to the hamper with his socks, put them in for him and then give him a nice big juicy kiss, right, whatever. But see, that’s where you’re leading, that’s where you’re becoming more empowered, that’s where you’re learning how to be better and improve the environment, not only for yourself, but for your household.
53:56 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Right, right. I liken this, what we’re talking about, to one of the titles of your chapters of Crash Dunnys, because I had fun with that. My son, when he was little, had that back in the day. That’s when they first actually were putting out toys of the little collapsible Crash Dunnys and the minute I read that I started laughing because I could just see that you’re purposely just crashing these things into stuff to learn what’s going to happen. What terrible thing. How bad can this get? Yeah?
54:33 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yes.
54:34 – Jaime Luce (Host)
And we don’t want to do that. We don’t want to be a Crash Dummy. We don’t want to be the one that has to constantly, you know, do the crash and burn situation in our life and have to learn from that. Why waste the years and the time? It doesn’t have to be that way, it doesn’t have to be that way.
54:57 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
And I start out that chapter telling about the very public, publicized story. There’s even documentaries and movies about it. The lady who her husband worked in a jail and they had this very kind of mundane, average lifestyle, you know the kind that some people would give anything for. Husband loved his wife, treated her good, but she just wanted something else. And she’s around these inmates all the time and a couple of them start flirting with her and the story goes on. She becomes romantically involved with them. Well, of course, they’re just using her and they plan this elaborate escape and she agrees to help them.
55:40
And it’s unbelievable, because I did watch it and I thought how, how? But then I realized she had a need. She had a need to be told she was pretty, she had a need to have somebody pay attention to her. She had that and it was dangerous, but she had an admit Need. Now she ended up doing jail time for that and when she got out her husband was still waiting for her. I bet he looks pretty good in her eyes, but yeah, so that was where I was headed with. Christ on me says that if we don’t lead, if we don’t govern ourselves, if we don’t Stop living it from one volatile situation to another and, on purpose, live a strong Mission overflowing abundant life. Right, We’ve got to get these unmet needs taken care of, or, at some point, though, something in us will erupt, right, it’ll start to burn, right, right? Well, we’ll have a kind of hell on earth. We’ll be fall out for sure.
56:48 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yes, maybe fall out. Yeah, absolutely Okay, we’ll take us to. On page 132 you have the faith versus fantasy. Okay, and I, like you, give the the biblical reference in Proverbs 13, 12. Hope deferred makes the heart sick, but a longing fulfilled is a treat of life. Take us into If if we’re saying, okay, I hear you, I hear what you’re saying, deborah, I, I need to start taking the control back. There are things I can do. I can govern myself. I know, I know I need to be introspective. I’ve got these tools, but they’re eyesight going forward. You know we don’t want to be clouded by old, old ways, old things. We don’t want the old mess to govern how we see moving forward. There’s a difference between faith and fantasy. So maybe I’m going to take us into this and and help us with this Absolutely.
57:58 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
When I talk about faith versus fantasy, I am all about setting high goals, and we’ve heard people say I’d rather believe God for big and get 50% of it, then believe him for small and get all of it. So, so where is our faith? A Good way, I believe, to stay in faith. The Bible says faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Not having heard, but a continual hearing. So one thing I did many years ago was I turned my car into my college and Every time I was in my car I would listen to a faith building message. You know, back then it was cassette tapes, or then we graduated on to see these. Now you can just listen to YouTube and right right get all kinds of messages.
58:52 – Jaime Luce (Host)
I’m sorry, my school too.
58:54 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yes.
58:54 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Yes.
58:55 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
So by now I should have a couple of doctorate degrees.
59:00
But the thing of it is, I tell a story in here about when I was a single mom and hopefully this will show the the, the, the difference here between arm, am I in faith or am I in fantasy? But I was a single mom and I was looking for a place to live because I had been the mayor to home had to be sold. So After not working for quite a few years, you know I’m back in the working a job, and I had it set in my mind that I wanted to live in this really pretty community and Blah, blah, blah, which, ironically enough, is where I live now, but not then right, not then right. And so I kind of wouldn’t budge in my thinking, because you know I’m coming out of a lot of hurt, I’m coming out of a lot of disappointment, a lot of pain. So my thinking was well, according to Isaiah 61, 7, double for my trouble you know I deserve this mansion on the hill that you know.
59:58
I have two dollars to buy. You know, yeah, I think we could see where the fantasies coming in here, right, and you know it. But but here’s the thing when I went to talk about crazy and hearing from God, I was in church one morning and I’ve got this house on my mind and I had just been to a ladies Bible study before service. We had her ladies Bible study really early on Sunday morning and this lady said to me she knew I was believing for a place to live. She said don’t get so set on one house. And I did, I was. And Even when she said that, not knowing that’s what I had done, I Wasn’t really ready to give that thought up yet. So I’m in church and here it was just like a little bird just kind of flew by and I heard the word anthem, anthem. And Then later I felt impressed she drive behind this grocery store. So I just drove the one street behind the store and I see there’s nothing back here. I’m gonna go back to believe it for my house. Okay.
01:01:03
So time came and went and I even tried to rent a house and they said no. So what happened was one day I decided to come off my high horse and get on faith. And I’m driving down the street, I’m praising God, still looking for a place to live, and I had like four days left to find somewhere. And so I stopped at this realtors office. I said do you have any homes to rent in this area? Well, long story short, the Development’s name was anthem Park and it was one block behind the grocery store.
01:01:43
Wow first I was in fantasy. I just thought that somehow at the at the time, the house was, I don’t know, probably six hundred thousand dollars and I’ve got, like you know, two dollars at my savings at that point. Yeah, so you can take a scripture and you can really make it, say anything you want, right. But what happened was, just prior to finding this house, this, the money came through From the cell of the marital home and I had more than enough for this brand new small house in a much smaller community not on a golf course, you know and I was able to to get in, pay the security posits, do all that. And the land the landlord. The landlord had purchased it months prior and said I could not understand why anybody was not renting this brand new little house that was perfect for my family at the time, because God was saving it for me and waiting for my faith To catch up with his plan instead of and get me out of fantasy, landed off the small world ride, you know.
01:02:50
So there’s a difference. You, you can’t look at the first guy that comes into church in a while who’s single and single and smells good, and say God told me that’s he’s for me. Maybe not. That might be your fantasy, but is that Really for you and I’ve seen women do this They’ll go. God told me I’m gonna marry him. He’s the guy’s been to church twice and already you’re going around telling people you’re going to marry him. That’s fantasy and it’s your emotions are all wrapped up in that. That’s why I say in the book you can be dressed from head to toe in Dior and still be stupid.
01:03:29
Yeah you know you can have the PhD hanging on your wall. But where your emotions are concerned because especially if you’re getting up there in years and you want a family, you want children the biological clock is ticking. That’s where I’ve seen some of the worst Is that an eligible guy walks by who smells good, and we get into that fantasy. For mine, maybe not, yeah, maybe not. That’s why we have to be there. That’s why we have to keep building our faith and operate. Of course, stretch yourself, oh, of course right.
01:04:00
But you know God, god’s cool. Sometimes he will tell you to open the donut shop when you’ve got a dime in your pocket. Sometimes those things do happen, but there are levels of faith and the Bible says it’s according to our faith right. So we just have to be sure that we are operating in faith right and not just out of the fantasy of our own imagination right, I’m thinking of the passage that says that we can.
01:04:31 – Jaime Luce (Host)
We can ask for something, but we don’t get it because we ask a miss.
01:04:34
Yeah so there’s a, there’s a submission that takes place that says Lord, I’m not, I’m not coming to you to ask for just what I want. Hmm, I have submitted my life to you, so what do you have for me? Because whatever you have for me is good. I don’t have to worry that it’s going to have all these problems that I could, that are Unforeseen to me, that I could think I know what’s good for me, I know what I want and I’m not willing to hear anybody else about it.
01:05:02 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Yes.
01:05:03 – Jaime Luce (Host)
I don’t recognize all the problems a pastor of Gateway Church in Texas, pastor Robert Morris we had lived out South like, south like for a little while and attended the church there and he tells the story of how they were getting ready to buy a house and it was. They thought this was the dream house. They wanted this house and they had the finances to buy the house, and they were getting ready to do everything that they needed to and something happened. I don’t remember the full story. Something happened the day that stops them from doing this and they’re they’re thinking why did that happen? Why, why can’t we get down there to get this, make this happen? And then, literally I don’t know if it was the next day or day after, it was a very, very small amount of time a huge flood Happened like and that house was wrecked and they would have just purchased it and God was sparing them. Yes, no, it’s like it’s so.
01:05:55
I just learned my if I’m gonna say what I’ve learned from from my crash dummy, and all right, I’m gonna say that listen, if you’re still living, just to please you, there’s a lot of work that needs to be done. Yeah, if you think you know what’s best for you. All you have to do is look around you and realize you don’t know what you’re doing. Yeah, that’s why the mess is there. You don’t know what you’re doing. Yeah, you need God to tell you this. I have a plan for you. Yes, man, I have for you. It’s good, it’s good, you can trust this. Yes, you’re gonna be happy with what I have for you. It’s just that you have to be willing to say okay, not my will, but yours be done. I submit myself to his will, submit myself to his plan, and it will be good. You’re gonna Really be happy with this. This is, we tell ourselves. Only this will make me happy. Well, that’s fantasy, because you don’t know everything about that. Anyway, you don’t know tomorrow. You don’t have, you don’t have control over time. You don’t have control over your next breath, because you know what’s gonna happen tomorrow or how this is gonna affect you. You don’t know that, so don’t know.
01:07:01
I’m willing to be humble and say Lord, I don’t know. You do know. Yes, not only do you know what, you know Everything. You are outside of time. There is nothing that’s old or new to you, it’s all just there. Yes, you’re not encumbered by anything. You know it all. So, because you do, you know how to bless me, you know how to protect me, you know how to direct me, you know how, what, that, what will meet the need that I’m trying to satisfy and I think these things are gonna meet that need. You’re saying no, that’s not gonna meet your need, you’re asking a miss, I’m not gonna answer those prayers and you think God’s not listening to you. And you, you know you’re. You walk away and you quit praying because you think God doesn’t listen to me. That doesn’t work for me, that works for other people, that just doesn’t work for me. I don’t hear him. Maybe we’re asking a miss. Yeah, the problem is not that God’s not hearing you, he’s just saying no, no, that’s no.
01:07:56 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
No, not right now. Right, right, you know. The house I told you about that I originally just sunk my teeth into. The housing market at the time was at its height. It was. It was at the height, yeah, and what happened was after that it started to crash, and it crashed for several years. Yeah, when I was able to come to this neighborhood, the housing prices were in the tank. Wow, no sooner did I sign on the dotted line and this time I didn’t have to rent, I was able to purchase, right, no sooner did I sign. The housing prices have climbed and they’ve never stopped. Yeah, and so you know, in this area, and so You’re. Everything you’re saying is so right on. I was prideful, I was hurt, and when you’re hurt, you can get prideful. I deserve this. Look at what I’ve been through. I didn’t. I didn’t deserve any of this. Look how bad they did to me, and I, I mean double for my trouble. Well, yeah, god promises double for our trouble, but probably not with that kind of an attitude, right?
01:08:59 – Jaime Luce (Host)
We’re kind of fooling ourselves by doing that because we’re saying it shouldn’t be this way. Yeah, well, I’m the we mix up, thinking I’m gonna stand up for myself, yes, and we don’t realize that that can all. Yes, sometimes we have to stand up for ourself, but, but what we can be doing is saying, in that that I’m now taking control in a way that I am not allowing the Lord to Lead me. So what is still leading me? It’s still that pain. Yeah, now it is coming out in pride. Now it’s coming out and I’m gonna, I’m good enough, I can figure this out, I can do this.
01:09:32
And we don’t realize that we’re keeping ourselves in that same position, where we haven’t broke free from the fact that that Pain, that hurt, is what’s driving us. It’s still pushing, we’re just. It just is manifesting in a little bit different way and we think we’ve made progress. You know we’re doing good. So if that’s and again that goes back to the, the introspection, to why am I doing this?
01:09:57
What am I really feeling? What is this coming from? Why do? Why do I think that that house on the hill is the only thing that can meet my need? What? Why do I really feel that way. Yes, yes, go down to what that, what that root system is it’s like. Okay, this is really what I’m feeling, this is really my need and that’s why I want that and that’s why I like that. Okay, lord, I’m submitting this to you, you know, and allow him to comfort. He’s the comforter, yes, holy screw to comfort us in that pain and in that moment, so that we can see clear, to make the right choices, to be able to do whatever it is that we need to do For in due season. Yes, we will reap if we faint, not so amen.
01:10:43 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
You did, you know. And faith you. You’ll know you’re in faith when you’re allowing the Holy Spirit to gently lead you. You’ll know you’re in fantasy when the devil or your own unmet needs or unresolved hurts and pains are pushing and driving you. I just got to have this and I’ve got to have it now. Right, fantasy, right, lord, I’m open, right, lead me, guide me.
01:11:15 – Jaime Luce (Host)
So good. My mom used to say that exact same thing teaching us growing up, and she’d say the Lord leads. Yes, he never forces, he never demands that you follow and to listen to what he’s saying to you. There are times when you can hear him loudly because you’re close enough and he’s warning, he’s doing something, he’s giving an instruction because you’ve invited it, but he always leads. He does not demand. So if you feel demanded of, if you feel pushed the enemy’s roaring, you have to know the difference between who’s speaking and it could be our pain yelling to it. It’s not always the devil, it can be. Our circumstance is screaming at us. My pain level is at its max and I’m feeling that pressure. It’s that understanding. Is this me or is this the Lord? That’s so good. That’s the absolute truth.
01:12:06
Okay, I have kept you an hour and 10 minutes so I want to wrap it up, but I know people are getting what they need from this, so I want to hit two real quick things. Okay, age 184, you talk about this is in passion. I wrote down this passion and or plan, passion or plan, because you have this in chapter 13, plans for you, and I highlighted this paragraph. Has something ever been ever made you come alive and caused you to burn with passion?
01:12:37
Subsequently, did someone try to throw a bucket of ice water in your direction? You have to write the vision God gives you so you can run with it. When you get home from some sorry, from something extraordinary like my Paris trip, and you are back to jealous friends calling you selfish for wanting another plane ticket, parents who think your dreams are stupid, a pastor who, rather than helping fan the flame, tries to extinguish it so you won’t ignite the congregation, writing the vision is a distant memory. That’s why you need to write and run with it, keeping it with you and before you. Let’s talk into that just for a moment.
01:13:17 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
So I am a huge proponent of writing the vision according to Habakkuk 2, 2 and 3. And you were talking a while ago about New Year’s resolutions and how most of them fall off. I’m writing my 2024 vision this week because I agree, I think, why wait until the first? I want to hit the ground running. And what happens is when you have a vision that breaks boundaries, that seems crazy. Now, I’m not talking about fantasy. I’m talking about God-inspired, holy Ghost-breathed vision, which can seem crazy at times and you don’t always understand it. God told Abraham get up, start moving. I’ll tell you when you’re there. Sometimes you have to do things like that, but what happens is sometimes even telling your church leadership, sometimes even telling your closest friends, they will look at you like you are crazy. And that’s why, when you have it written down, I’ve been, even now, putting pictures on my vision board and I have a vision notebook now. I’ve been putting pictures I just had them printed off at Staples yesterday to give myself a visual so that when someone raises an eyebrow or says something to me with an undertone, I am able to, as Habakkuk says, read it on the run. I think it’s the amplified says write it in big block letters so you can read it on the run. Because why on the run? Because people will try to grab your ankles and pull you down, especially if they’re not pursuing any kind of vision.
01:15:03
I’m a Keanu Reeves fan, I admit it, and so I have seen the John Wick movies and I know he’s an assassin Just give me some grace here. I just really like his acting and his whole style. So, but in the latest installment of that franchise they’re talking about him and they say they’re saying but in order to want to live, you have to be a man with a purpose, you have to have vision. That is the whole reason to get up in the morning, is to have a purpose. That is the whole reason to get out of bed. And if you’re in bad circumstances right now, the reason to get up is because tomorrow, today can be better than yesterday and tomorrow can be better than today. I’ll never forget when the Holy Spirit said to me. He said in your power or in your consistency lies your power. Whatever you do every day, whatever you are consistent in, and it doesn’t have to be huge, it doesn’t have to be overwhelming, but if you keep your vision before you and you look at it every day. You are going to draw to yourself what you are seeing. Remember that the speckled in the spotted sheep Okay, it’s because they saw the peeled bark at the watering hole. They saw something speckled and something genetically happened in them and they became speckled Right. And so when I talk about having vision, you live kind of on a different plane. Little things won’t bother you so bad when you have vision. When you have a purpose, you will find a way to get there by the leading of the Holy Spirit and you will throw off anything that tries to hold you back.
01:16:48
When I started going to the gym on a very, very regular basis 10 months ago, I was going. I was going and I had a vision for what I wanted to accomplish and for 10 months nothing happened. I didn’t lose one pound and I looked probably worse in my clothes, and finally I had this 360 degree body scan and I had a printout, a vision of my body shape, my BMI, just this whole vision. And finally I talked to the two trainers and they said the reason you’re not changing is because you are only taking cardio. You need to go back to lifting weights, which I used to do all the time I started lifting weights about five or six weeks ago, everything has changed.
01:17:38
I’ve lost four pounds. I look completely different in my clothes. I’ve even had to buy one size smaller pants. When you get a vision before you, I’m telling you you will go toward it, you will stay on track, you will stay on course. But you can’t have a vision and stick it in a drawer and look at it in six months. You’ve got to keep it before you. It’s kind of like having a personal trainer having a vision before you. It’ll keep you on course.
01:18:09 – Jaime Luce (Host)
It makes me think of two how, even in any kind of leadership training and anything to do with business development, they’ll tell you that you have to have a business plan. The understanding, I think, the good part about writing something down. If you put enough thought into what you’re writing down, not just kind of a half idea well, this is a lofty idea about something you someday want, well, that’s great. But that’s not a plan. The plan is when you have so thought out everything that needs to take place and all the components that need to come together. Then you have a way to say okay, I can’t work on this one. Then you still have all these in front of you that you know. Well, once I complete that, here’s the next thing I can do.
01:19:02
It’s when we don’t take the time to truly think about if we do this with our life, just to think about whether it’s relationships, whether it’s work, whether it’s like physical body, getting ourselves in shape. It reminds me of the. It seems so silly, but we all mess with this and it’s an easy fix. If you don’t think you should be eating it, don’t buy it and put it in your house. That’s part of the plan. When you go to the store, write the list and don’t buy anything that’s not on the list. Just don’t do it. Make it a discipline. If you don’t want to eat that, because you know you’re going to give into it, don’t buy it. Don’t buy it. If you’re going to eat it, you’re going to go. We need to be those who are. If you want things to be different, you have to be willing to say okay, then I’m going to actually be responsible. There are things that are responsible for that I need to do. It’s possible. Those things are possible, but it’s going to take my effort. I have something that I’m responsible for, so go. There’s one more thing I wanted to hit on page 189. I wrote this is under the section of all hope is not lost. This is why I wanted to go here to kind of wrap things up. No matter what anybody’s facing today I know that this is Debra’s heart, this is my heart All hope is not lost, no matter what you’ve suffered, no matter how bad it’s been, no matter if you feel like you had opportunity and you missed them, if you have felt like along the way, I should have taken that opportunity and I had that and I squandered it. So was the, so was the prodigal son. He had squandered his opportunity. That was not the end of the story for him. The pig pen was not where he would remain, and so I highlighted this and I thought this was really good.
01:20:58
So I want people who are listening to really perk up. First and you’re talking about this is your. You’re explaining the story of the four lepers. Okay, first Kings and his first or second Kings. Second Kings, sorry, second Kings, and it’s this is the process that someone with leprosy goes through, and you are picturing the difference then of how that is with us. We go through this. So I want I want people to listen to this.
01:21:29
Nummness sets in, followed by a loss of hot and cold sensations, causing everything to feel lukewarm to the sufferer. The eyes are affected, next a loss of vision and finally there is disfigurement, to the point the person no longer resembles who they once were. They look in the mirror and don’t recognize themselves, and the reason I wanted to read that is I feel like there are those listening today who feel that they identify with that, that they’ve gone numb, they don’t, they don’t really feel anymore, they don’t, and in that numbness you just think you reside yourself to this will always be this way. I no longer get happy, I no longer feel joy, I no longer have excitement. I also. I did that. I allowed that because I didn’t want to feel pain anymore and I didn’t want to feel disappointment anymore and I didn’t want to be discouraged anymore. And so then the problem with that is it doesn’t stay there, it graduates and they lose vision.
01:22:37
So if in that position of saying I’m not willing to feel, you’re cutting yourself off from the ability to see a way forward, so it’s imperative that we yes, you have feelings and yes, it’s right to feel them we just don’t let them govern us. It’s okay to say this was wrong, this hurt, and and we’re we’re saying with you today it did, you’re right, I validate you in that and it shouldn’t have happened. And there’s so many circumstances that with you, we empathize and we say I wish it wouldn’t have been this way. Yeah, it’s okay to mourn what has been lost, it’s okay to mourn what’s behind us, but it don’t don’t so allow yourself to be numbed to those feelings, because you will lose your vision. And we’re talking about you. You need a vision. You need to be able to see your way forward there, because this won’t be the end.
01:23:35
If you don’t have vision for forward, your life then will completely get disfigured. It won’t just stay here. This isn’t a. I say this all the time. My listeners are probably sick of hearing it, but you either grow or you die. There is no staying in the middle. There is no middle ground. It will progressively go one direction or the other. And so we, if we’re fooling ourselves to think that if I’m not taking steps, steps forward, if I am not seeing what I need to see and making those adjustments and those changes, that I’ll just stay here, cause at least this is what I know it won’t stay there. It will progressively disfigure, it will progressively get worse, and we will. It will cause us more damage. It will. It will make it that much harder to finally turn.
01:24:27
Today is the day of salvation. Today we make a decision. Like you said, why wait? Why am I waiting for January? Forget that. I’m writing this week, right now. I know I’ve got a vision. I’m going to do it. Why don’t you speak into that? And then, when you feel led, I will have you pray for our listeners and then we’ll discuss how to get ahold of you and your book and all that Sounds good so these four lepers have a classic line.
01:24:53 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
I mean, you got to imagine they’re sitting outside the camp. There’s a famine in the city, so there’s no food in the city, and they’re outside because of their leprosy. They’re locked out of the gate, so they’re sitting out there, you know, probably sharing their last damp sandwich, and all of a sudden they start going through their options. And that’s what I would like you to do today, is start to go through your options. They said well, we can just stay here where we’re at and we’re going to die. We’re just going to die if we just stay right here, or we can go into the city, but we’re going to starve in there because they don’t have any food. Either. They said, or we could get up and we could go down the road to the enemy camp, maybe they’ll save us alive, and they’ve got food, so if they don’t kill us, they’ll probably feed us. The classic line they say to one another is why sit we here until we die? If you just stay where you’re at, what’s going to happen is if where you’re sitting is abnormal, that’s going to become normal to you and you’re going to stop trying.
01:26:13
And it said that these lepers got up at twilight and they went into the enemy camp. They start looking around. There’s clothes everywhere. There’s turkey legs thrown everywhere. I mean, it’s just double for your trouble. It’s just everything they could possibly imagine, because when they got up and started moving, god made the enemy here, an army coming, and they all got scared. There’s that crazy thing. They got scared and they ran away. They dropped their clothes, they dropped their gold, their silver, their turkey legs. They dropped it all. And all of a sudden, these four lepers who are sitting there, deteriorating, losing their vision, losing their fingers, their noses, everything, all of a sudden they’re sitting back with King’s ropes on having passed the potato salad, and so they start feeling guilty, because back in the city they said we can’t just sit here and not tell anybody about this. This is wrong. So they go back and they share the good news. And that’s what Jamie and I want to do today. We want to share the news that don’t sit there until you die, don’t keep letting something be taken off your life, don’t keep falling further and further away from the very essence of who you are. Maybe you look nothing like you did five years ago, and I’m speaking not so much physically, but I’m speaking your inward self. Maybe you have no idea. I once had a vision for my life, but nah, I don’t know. I’m just so dire and so worn out. No, oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, baby, why sit you here until you die? Today’s the day that you get up at twilight and you start moving towards something. You start making a decision to govern yourself. You start making a decision to lead yourself. You start making a decision to better yourself.
01:28:06
To read a book, to listen to a podcast, listen. Don’t listen to this once. Listen to it over and over and over again. God wants you to get up and he wants to set you free from whatever is holding you down and chaining you and binding you. He wants you to think clearly. He wants you to speak his words. Where you are today could be a result of what you said about your life yesterday. So I go over this in the book. But if you’re not saying words that agree with good things and God things over your life, first of all, stop speaking negativity over your life. You probably have enough people speaking negatively about you. So you stop doing it. Ok, because you and God are a team. Now Don’t give up on your team. Stay with your team, and so I want to pray for you. Right now. I’m going to stretch my hands towards you and if you need this, get up and go prayer, then I want you to stretch your hands toward me.
01:28:58
Father, in the name of Jesus, I speak to every person, every man, every woman listening, young, old, middle age who just, it, feels like they just want to give up. They look nothing like they used to. They don’t even know what kind of vision they could possibly write down. Lord, begin to speak to them, begin to deal with them. Let a flicker of hope begin to spark in their spirit. Right now, lord, I just thank you, god, that you would stir up the gifts that are within them. You would give them a picture of who, not only they once were, but who they need to become. Lord, let them become forward focused. Let them drive out in securities.
01:29:33
I pray, lord, that you would just take insecurities and start to drive them out of their mind, out of their thinking, that they would begin to see the person that you have created them to be and they would not come behind him in anything. We break word curses off of you. We break intimidation off of you. We break fear and negativity off of you. In the name of Jesus, we speak life, life, life, life abundant over you. Lord, I ask you to just give them a vision. Let the sun begin to shine in their life. May the sun of righteousness arise and just send healing beams toward them in every direction healing in their bodies, healing in their mind, healing in their finances, healing in their relationships, healing in their family. And, lord, I pray that vision would begin to be stirred up. Let the vision that they once had, that’s been dormant, come alive again. You haven’t changed your mind. So I pray, lord, they get back on the stick with you and they would begin to speak positive things over themselves, even today. Don’t let the sun go down, lord, without them beginning to take a step in the right direction.
01:30:39
Now I want to speak to you. If you feel that God is impressing you or giving you, speaking to your spirit, listen, the enemy comes from out here. He tries to come at your mind. Your mind is in your thoughts, your imagination, but the spirit of God speaks inside of you, in the very core, in your spirit. So trust those things that come to you and God’s OK if you say Lord, could you confirm that to me? Could you show me from your word that this is really you? But then get yourself alone. Schedule some alone time for yourself so that you can begin to work with the Holy Spirit and cultivate a deeper relationship with Him, so that he can begin to lead you and guide you and direct you, according to Psalms 32, 8. He will lead you and guide you. His eye will be upon you. We seal this with a giant in Jesus’ name. Amen and amen.
01:31:34 – Jaime Luce (Host)
Amen, so good. I know that this has helped so many at different points, different stations in life, different ages. I know that it has. So how can they get ahold of your book? How can they get ahold of you? You do ministry all over. You speak to churches, you’ve spoken in missions, you’ve gone all out of the country, you’ve been all over. So how do we get ahold of you? And how do we get ahold of your book? She also has another book I know we didn’t talk about it today, but she also has another book on healing, so you can get ahold of that too. But how can I reach you so single?
01:32:12 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
and sublime, and my name is there on the screen If you just look it up. It is on Amazon in paperback and ebook. It’s also Barnes and Noble, google Playbooks and there’s one other place that I’m just skipping you right now, but those are all ebook formats. If you want the paperback, it would be available to you on Amazon. And yes, I also have a book called Healing from Heaven and it’s for those of you who are having trouble with your physical body how God wants to put you back in pristine condition, the way he designed for your body to be, and that is also available.
01:32:46 – Jaime Luce (Host)
The same way. Ok, and do you have a website that they can visit or anything that they can reach you?
01:32:52 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
So it’s my name depragascoorg, also on Facebook, and I just joined the ranks this week of TikTok, because I am now and I’m on YouTube and again it is my name, it’s just my handle on YouTube and what I am doing starting last week is every week I am putting out a 60-second video called Healing Help and it’s just a quick nugget for people who are suffering in their physical body. With all the technology and the advancements in the medication and the surgeries, 98% of the world has something wrong with their body and a very large percentage of those have five or more things wrong with them. So every week it’ll be on YouTube short and also on Facebook real, and it is 60 seconds. There’s two out so far. Fantastic. Thank you, jamie. Thank you so much. Oh, thank you.
01:33:51 – Jaime Luce (Host)
This has been a pleasure, and well, I know you’re going to have more books in you, I know, so we’ll have you back again, for sure.
01:33:57 – Deborah Gaskell (Guest)
Two come in in 2024. I’ve got two books. I knew it OK.
01:34:02 – Jaime Luce (Host)
So thank you so much for being with me today. Deborah, thank you for joining us. This is a pleasure for us to be with you and share the content of this book with you Sink Lense, sublime. Get yourself a copy and send her a note. Review it. Go on. When you get the books, give her a review.
01:34:18
That always helps us when we’re for authors anyway. It’s just a great way to help keep us in the algorithms, because they’re impossible to keep up with. So anyway, again, it was our treat to be with you and we know this has been a blessing to you. Share this message with somebody that you know needs to hear it that’s our heart is to get it to as many people who need to hear it as possible, and you can help us doing that by giving us a like and a share, and I’d love to hear from you If this has blessed your life in some way. I’d love to hear from you through email. You can do that at mail at jamieloosecom, and you can visit my website, jamieloosecom, as well, and get a hold of any of the information stuff that I’ve got, as well as my book. You can find it there or on Amazon too. So thanks again for being with us today. We’ll see you next time. Bye, bye.
